From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Current CVS doesn't bootstrap Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 17:05:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <200411072305.iA7N5Qc02774@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <01c4c3f3$Blat.v2.2.2$7e8aa060@zahav.net.il> <01c4c41c$Blat.v2.2.2$0fa338a0@zahav.net.il> <200411062248.iA6MmEm29919@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <01c4c487$Blat.v2.2.2$d4c31400@zahav.net.il> <200411071743.iA7Hhfi01732@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <01c4c519$Blat.v2.2.2$30b5eda0@zahav.net.il> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1099868886 22617 80.91.229.6 (7 Nov 2004 23:08:06 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 23:08:06 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Nov 08 00:07:55 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1CQw8X-0006y5-00 for ; Mon, 08 Nov 2004 00:07:53 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CQwGq-00012m-Fj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:16:28 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CQwGj-00012V-5p for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:16:21 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CQwGi-000128-F7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:16:20 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CQwGi-000125-CR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:16:20 -0500 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CQw6l-000401-IU; Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:06:03 -0500 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id iA7N5vFu018602; Sun, 7 Nov 2004 17:05:57 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id iA7N5Qc02774; Sun, 7 Nov 2004 17:05:26 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: eliz@gnu.org In-reply-to: <01c4c519$Blat.v2.2.2$30b5eda0@zahav.net.il> (eliz@gnu.org) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:29541 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:29541 Eli Zaretskii wrote: Are you saying that a bootstrap should always be preceded by a "make maintainer-clean"? If you want to be _completely_ sure that your version of Emacs is fully up to date. I believe that there are two situations where people usually run `make bootstrap': if they experience problems or if they have a fast computer. In case of problems, I believe it is advisable to run `make maintainer-clean'. If your computer is fast enough, the entire purpose of running the `make bootstrap' sequence is to be completely safe, so it would be inconsistent not to run `make maintainer-clean'. Apparently Stefan knows a counterexample to these rules. If so, why doesn't "make bootstrap" does the equivalent of "make maintainer-clean" automatically? It used to do so. Then Stefan changed it to speed up bootstrapping. But we have had plenty of bug reports because of this. As already mentioned, we had a discussion on this and I believe that Stefan agreed that `make bootstrap' should be reverted to its old behavior, and that a new target `make bootstrap-build' should do what the current `make bootstrap' does. Maybe some of the imperfect, but fast, proposed partial solutions could be applied to this new target. They would not make it 100% safe, but much safer than it is now. (Btw, I still didn't see any explanation why a "cvs up" that updates easymenu.el causes a failure to load cl-macs, which was the specific problem I reported. Without seeing such an explanation, this entire argument sounds a bit academic to me.) It would be, if this were the only instance of the problem, but it is just the latest in a long list. It is very far from the first and if nothing is changed it will be very far from the last. Sincerely, Luc.