From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Setting font to Lucida Grande on Mac OS X Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 13:23:50 -0500 (CDT) Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <200309221823.h8MINoI08026@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <200309151509.h8FF95Z22652@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87y8wpie1w.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <200309170234.h8H2YH706063@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87pthzfvt3.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <3F68584E.7010900@gnu.org> <200309171655.h8HGtbl08972@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87d6dx82kq.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <200309191534.h8JFY4Z25206@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <87y8wh2jpu.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1064255869 20370 80.91.224.253 (22 Sep 2003 18:37:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 18:37:49 +0000 (UTC) Cc: stephen@xemacs.org, jasonr@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 22 20:37:46 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A1VZC-0001Do-00 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 20:37:46 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A1Vf7-0003Z6-00 for ; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 20:43:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A1VPz-0005Dy-BY for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 14:28:15 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A1VPA-00051S-C3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 14:27:24 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A1VP8-00050n-0L for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 14:27:22 -0400 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A1VP5-0004zX-Am; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 14:27:19 -0400 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h8MIRHAJ011557; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 13:27:17 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h8MINoI08026; Mon, 22 Sep 2003 13:23:50 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: stephen@xemacs.org In-reply-to: <87y8wh2jpu.fsf@tleepslib.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> (stephen@xemacs.org) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:16558 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:16558 Richard Stallman wrote: However, matching is ! implementation-dependent, and often inaccurate, when wildcards match ! dashes in a long name. It works best if you supply all 14 dashes. The first sentence seems to imply that wildcards are so unreliable that you should never use them. It is clearer to say However, matching is implementation-dependent, and can be inaccurate when wildcards match dashes in a long name. For reliable results, supply all 14 dashes and use wildcards only within a field. and Stephen J. Turnbull replied: The second sentence is a distinct improvement (especially as it implies partial matching in a field, which often is useful, such as ...-jisx0208*-0 to catch names which specify the year of the standard), but I recommend that the first sentence be left as is. I believe the difference of opinion is limited to: "often inaccurate" (Stephen's version) vs "can be inaccurate" (Richard's version). I believe that we all agree with what is meant to be communicated, namely: 1. It is OK to try out, say: M-x set-frame-font RET *-courier-medium-r-*-14-* Why type fourteen dashes if you can get what you want with the above? (This works for me.) 2. If you do M-x set-frame-font RET -abisource-courier-bold-i-normal--17-* and get the error message: Font `-abisource-courier-bold-i-normal--17-*' is not defined (as I do), then this does _not_ mean that there really is no such font. In fact, after supplying the fourteen dashes I get the font: -abisource-courier-bold-i-normal--17-135-90-91-p-100-iso8859-1 3. Always supply fourteen dashes for Elisp code, except when only meant for personal use. All XLFD's I found in the Emacs source code actually adhere to this rule. To me, both versions suggest 1-3 above, even though Richard's puts somewhat more emphasis on (1) and Stephen's on (2) and (3). To me the difference does not seem terribly big. My patch currently contains Richard's version, but I will wait at least 24 more hours before committing it, so everybody can make further comments. (Of course, further changes can also be made after I commit.) Sincerely, Luc.