From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: GNU Emacs raison d'etre Date: Sat, 16 May 2020 03:03:00 +0300 Message-ID: <1ea0e6d8-976a-4c22-d407-027adbbeb721@yandex.ru> References: <5230692c-c665-a330-7a12-e59fa25d97dd@gmail.com> <70bb51fd-447d-928c-4d69-1c9673a44471@online.de> <871rnnvmdx.fsf@red-bean.com> <87pnb7sira.fsf@red-bean.com> <06bcddd4-6991-e4f7-e944-93de14af263d@yandex.ru> <87h7wjsd8o.fsf@red-bean.com> <20897f01-122d-7f91-eac2-70f5ad75796f@yandex.ru> <87d077qfmm.fsf@red-bean.com> <874ksglvsd.fsf@red-bean.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="114660"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.7.0 Cc: andreas.roehler@online.de, Richard Stallman , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Arthur Miller , Karl Fogel Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 16 02:03:51 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jZkIw-000Tiv-HP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 16 May 2020 02:03:50 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54264 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZkIv-0005Ln-JP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 20:03:49 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33836) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZkIF-0004v0-RZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 15 May 2020 20:03:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x42b.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42b]:35950) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZkIE-00004t-QN; Fri, 15 May 2020 20:03:07 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x42b.google.com with SMTP id k13so3261607wrx.3; Fri, 15 May 2020 17:03:05 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=UaJ3Ac3gImJQ9VA2i47JRaWiD8oUw48STPoiV8NeH/I=; b=sssWPvMJfJbYvIECFgxla4uiQTDkNBLI9kYHX7ZY2mQV+KF2/1mHGNYtwph1Shhjco O0dmCFPGofC3Xb671+UYbQ1nLD0SawaC2r5+s0uRE7aDItOLggpAcraAJHOCjz7OiUqj qjQiFktawHhppIycAJnBgSE1dozkWxNdpkONy0MlIKvvLPB9oDf6lVevJdFDPXn+fHBU gydTFi78cJ67ePFkX0a4v8BlbfjgacbQoWwMQ3G248YUjD9wPfxXJoQn3446hnp6G13a zAa29FlS+bvhs/7TDm0F6dpAyfld32DXY37op2UiHqDvgltOvRkNpXTFvsaN7/G+yP9U HBGA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=UaJ3Ac3gImJQ9VA2i47JRaWiD8oUw48STPoiV8NeH/I=; b=RIsbBbTnNvnCwGtfj42IlvQFK9WYtFWYCOjr017LmRcvO/ODQn//i0jEKgQA961V0p 6cFNMcCOzoV2LGp0VRWB9psZ14WcCKiqPD7TLC9psJnanWYvdF52Fer4kKi1yaG22Pne kry1daEgU+ob6Nq2FKFp8hmxnfXrXz1N6HRt47NNmiYsI7VSKkcpVdi/O/TPH3yBBWx2 1y+HzBNS9L6ico4yzqL9g1UrjIsBgrdzXNjEoUbA9ZnJZwieOwRpJDRSKS09X/5MwyKE ar/LKNci+U5Jq1m0TzzDdBHdwDJsT2VIPO9NvToJAQD/dUg2WWbaDnpiTayTSSOIk7SL hCng== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531HTd5NwvUAOczYSoIit7jrMbFvilClBOw8hYDZZQ9EazgCWDgz 3ZoF5ya+SPAqLvS1YGs9wN8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxjXDoG/fwRb5PPtgbBta0rZw1nH+nOGKf4iII5vyHzWwWJulJoUA0Uhigmb7KuQhFsp2/rdw== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:668d:: with SMTP id l13mr6698681wru.214.1589587384156; Fri, 15 May 2020 17:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.3] ([66.205.73.129]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id a12sm5727069wro.68.2020.05.15.17.03.02 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 15 May 2020 17:03:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42b; envelope-from=raaahh@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42b.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -17 X-Spam_score: -1.8 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:250437 Archived-At: On 16.05.2020 01:14, Arthur Miller wrote: > I dont' know if others are like me and just want to do their typing, or > if Emacs is nowdays better at introducing itself, but I remember my > first time with it, and it was annoying. It's probably better "at introducing itself" too, but not by orders of magnitude. But it for sure can do more, both with advancements in the core and with considerable help from the third-party community and the overall language support ecosystem (LSP, for example). So it's quite powerful from the outset. And okay, maybe it will take some users a few months to start writing their own commands (and some will simply never do it), but it all depends on how they were introduced to Emacs, and what their immediate needs are.