From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Rusi Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: [screenshot] Emacs instant colors (and the Elisp full cycle) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 19:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1d573ae0-bede-416b-987b-e1c973dafbee@googlegroups.com> References: <874moae3ub.fsf@debian.uxu> <87zj61w1h4.fsf@debian.uxu> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1429669523 7933 80.91.229.3 (22 Apr 2015 02:25:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 02:25:23 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 22 04:25:18 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YkkLl-0002Vo-NM for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 22 Apr 2015 04:25:17 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:32940 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YkkLl-00066k-0d for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 21 Apr 2015 22:25:17 -0400 X-Received: by 10.140.145.199 with SMTP id 190mr33889202qhr.2.1429669488986; Tue, 21 Apr 2015 19:24:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.50.109.137 with SMTP id hs9mr22241igb.1.1429669488949; Tue, 21 Apr 2015 19:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!j5no3069774qga.1!news-out.google.com!n7ni13617igk.0!nntp.google.com!l13no8404234iga.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help In-Reply-To: <87zj61w1h4.fsf@debian.uxu> Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=117.195.63.126; posting-account=mBpa7woAAAAGLEWUUKpmbxm-Quu5D8ui Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 117.195.63.126 User-Agent: G2/1.0 Injection-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 02:24:48 +0000 Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:211639 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:103921 Archived-At: On Wednesday, April 22, 2015 at 4:04:22 AM UTC+5:30, Emanuel Berg wrote: > Rusi writes: > > >> If you understand exactly what I mean, take a look > >> at this screenshot to be even more confused: > >> > >> http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573/pics/instant-colors.png > > > > Cute! > > Ain't it the truth! > > But it is also practical because often you do not > remember what face is which color. > > For the purists, agreed, this is non-textbook usage > because the thought is of course to set those faces to > something sensible (sensible colors) *once*, and from > that point use the faces semantically, to express > purpose - the assumption being their color values make > sense. However, it has happened to me many times that > I do *not* use them that way but instead use them as > mere (?) placeholders for face colors, and then it is > very useful to just type the face name to see the > color it represents. > > Besides, in principle it doesn't conflicts supposedly > (?) proper usage to have them in cool colors, only > then that is more a cool stunt rather than an > advantage in productivity as well. > > > As it happens I was trying to illustrate/educate > > folks on the python list on something very similar > > about the nature and power of lisp: > > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.lang.python/QF0-A1F4miw/GOHMu0HNZocJ > > Holly would if she could. If you have a non-JavaScript > version of that I'll read it. Thread starts here https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/2015-April/701924.html BartC asks for switchable syntax: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/2015-April/701998.html Dan Sommers understands that "you want Lisp, the programmable programming language." : https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/2015-April/702018.html Subsequent would show that no one really understands what lisp is about or even the possibility of 'switchable syntax' > > > If you tell me the underlying machinery, I'll point > > them to it. [Or of course you can join that > > conversation] > > You ask me to tell you so THEY will understand? :) > > Well, in the smallest possible picture, it is very > simple. When the face names themselves are typed in > a buffer, they appear in the same color as they would > give the entities that are associated with them. > This makes it is easier to set up such associations > because you can see on the face name what the result > will be. > > What this illustrates on a somewhat bigger scale is > that Elisp is used to improve the tool which you use > to write Elisp. > > On the biggest scale it is the computer exponential > success story with computers and programmers taking > turns making each other better. That is in principle > equally true with bulky compiled languages (like C), > however with Lisp (and not just this particular > example) you can feel it instantly. It is a mighty > realization, even for a might programmer. > > Did that make sense? Perhaps only to people who > already understand it. Remember the words of > Saint Morpheus: "Unfortunately, no one can be told > what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself." The broader picture(s) is fine; I was asking specifically about the fontlock Is it vanilla FL or have you done something to make the name of the facename have the color named? Because it is exactly this kind of 'introspection' that that thread (non)understands