From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Bozhidar Batsov" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: NonGNU ELPA: add Logview Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2023 16:34:43 +0300 Message-ID: <1a929a7e-eccd-4c2c-958b-9bdc99e63d42@app.fastmail.com> References: <87r0pk7wg9.fsf@posteo.net> <9ee6db6c-b90a-450a-8f6e-02c8b8b2ad9e@app.fastmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=11fb895cddd6450fa1cddd86a1ffafeb Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22685"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.9.0-alpha0-531-gfdfa13a06d-fm-20230703.001-gfdfa13a0 Cc: "Emacs Devel" To: "Paul Pogonyshev" , "Philip Kaludercic" , "Emacs Devel" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 13 15:36:06 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qJwUF-0005a9-SZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 15:36:05 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qJwTT-0007mP-8b; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:15 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qJwTR-0007mB-5F for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:13 -0400 Original-Received: from wout1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([64.147.123.24]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qJwTN-0003lg-Ke for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:12 -0400 Original-Received: from compute1.internal (compute1.nyi.internal [10.202.2.41]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95D2132009A0; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:06 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:06 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=batsov.dev; h=cc :cc:content-type:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender :subject:subject:to:to; s=fm2; t=1689255306; x=1689341706; bh=QD AKwAePybNNqBy0pvlq2/Lpu4Uv2HMZ+QZ24i0AKM8=; b=DH2quuFjTILtmQZtPm WE8iLCySWxwKXxzltxydQ5c6d/mWMCCqy2HEFeLfD1IwJbOJGVRybZyVND709KpL 05pbBD628y+/qsTvDirEDTsHO9uNkXxASc2jrU2be3KjAqSdX+MR99a6jbxoh/Z6 5HHV0NOCX3MZEBUsSJN+qD1epCuJxuwqq5Gg8f49+GAQYWy9XwR9uQ58bEXM3wPX vzMjeJB5tt7c5saUsKgxnF+N/iSjnCbTkzEOfhjATrHlVJCxdfkm2Bf3A6nATHGw URBNBhmbIbq2MoWZAar3W8MkTPldDoaBzJdQtu7NbaEs4SusAru2e/+xpVtIy8dO /1zQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:content-type:date:date :feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject :subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; t=1689255306; x=1689341706; bh=QDAKwAePybNNq By0pvlq2/Lpu4Uv2HMZ+QZ24i0AKM8=; b=l04Qah5mJV7yj1TotFLiKEKq+wYRp qc6wTaM/j2gj3lfqVXBb5NW7CisvETCt9T6zJp3B64Anmyjmu/P32Ewq/ojvaeFG Sa/IGmWv64URE/4j0bk5+go2VmB+YNO5LilpWLXyNzdRqHSSlJeWJVD5bPEo6w0W 5+FdT7EZAmGNAuwkxZXslwVCgfhVy3QuVubdC03PerOJa7YQ5bvQzLF6Nru7+efg GdN4q2ZGeFVM02MdkAvkSr5d6gfnCo821fSaK+0Azd3j0Nv5+rKsjHNKPHPnZNoD s8RCmDGQf0xbQlVEJce/EO6+X3ENpL4Co2BqtF5bJcJGUibV/MSnOs2HA== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedviedrfeeggdeiiecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvvefutgesrgdtreerreerjeenucfhrhhomhepfdeuohii hhhiuggrrhcuuegrthhsohhvfdcuoegsohiihhhiuggrrhessggrthhsohhvrdguvghvqe enucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeehtdefveetvddvffeuuefhlefhhfegiefgffeifffffedv uefgfeelhfffkeehhfenucffohhmrghinheptghiuggvrhdrmhigpdhgihhthhhusgdrtg homhenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpegs ohiihhhiuggrrhessggrthhsohhvrdguvghv X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i025946a9:Fastmail Original-Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id B964D2D400A3; Thu, 13 Jul 2023 09:35:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface In-Reply-To: <9ee6db6c-b90a-450a-8f6e-02c8b8b2ad9e@app.fastmail.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.147.123.24; envelope-from=bozhidar@batsov.dev; helo=wout1-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:307816 Archived-At: --11fb895cddd6450fa1cddd86a1ffafeb Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just bumping this conversation, as we're still looking for someone to he= lp us apply the patch.=20 On Fri, Jul 7, 2023, at 8:21 AM, Bozhidar Batsov wrote: > Yeah, CIDER recently introduced some functionality that uses Logview i= nternally (see https://docs.cider.mx/cider/debugging/logging.html), that= 's why for us it's important for the package to be available on NonGNU E= LPA. I think that Logview is a great and very useful package on its own,= btw, so even without CIDER's immediate need I'd still advocate for its = inclusion there. >=20 > Can't speak about Logview's deps (as I'm not familiar with them), but = I know Paul is a great package maintainer, so I'm pretty sure that if he= had to create some additional library there was a real need for it. >=20 > On Thu, Jul 6, 2023, at 10:47 PM, Paul Pogonyshev wrote: >> > Without understanding the issue properly, why is there a need for a= n external data-time parsing package, if Emacs already comes with functi= ons for parsing timestamps? >>=20 >> For speed. Logview is aimed at very large logs (megabytes) and also f= or lazily filtering them on-the-fly, adding/removing filters and so on. = Built-in functions were not fast enough, so I had to create datetime. Al= so for matching: there is no standard timestamp format, the library help= s me at building regexs needed to match timestamps in given format and a= lso trying to guess which of many possible formats to use for a particul= ar file. >>=20 >> I didn't create the library just for fun, I saw a need for it. >>=20 >> > It appears to use use this extmap package, which parses binary data? >>=20 >> Yes. >>=20 >> > How is this all related to CIDER? >>=20 >> "This all" is not related to CIDER, because this is Logview's impleme= ntation details. CIDER recently added some log-related functionality and= they'd like to use Logview as the base for their mode, as far as I unde= rstand. They don't need datetime or extmap, but according to NonGNU ELPA= policy, Logview cannot be added without its dependencies. >>=20 >> > If possible, please add ".elpaignore" files to the repositories the= mselves, so that we can void tracking the files in elpa-packages itself. >>=20 >> OK, I will do that if the packages get added to the archive. Don't wa= nt to create files while I'm not sure they would be used for anything. >>=20 >> Paul >>=20 >> On Thu, 6 Jul 2023 at 19:59, Philip Kaludercic w= rote: >>>=20 >>> "Bozhidar Batsov" writes: >>>=20 >>> > Thanks for putting the patch together so quickly! >>> > >>> > Phillip, can you help us to get it applied? >>>=20 >>> Applying the patch is not the issue, I am just personally hesitant to >>> add a bunch of dependencies/packages I have never heard about before, >>> more so because I don't use CIDER, /especially/ when I lack the time= to >>> properly review them (the argument that a package is "mature on MELP= A" >>> is rather weak from my experience, especially given the number of low >>> quality packages on the archive). >>>=20 >>> Without understanding the issue properly, why is there a need for an >>> external data-time parsing package, if Emacs already comes with >>> functions for parsing timestamps? It appears to use use this extmap >>> package, which parses binary data? How is this all related to CIDER? >>>=20 >>> But perhaps I am in a minority here, and we should just apply the pa= tch. >>>=20 >>> > On Thu, Jul 6, 2023, at 7:14 PM, Paul Pogonyshev wrote: >>> >> Hi, >>> >> >>> >> Bozhidar Batsov, author and maintainer of CIDER, requested for >>> >> package Logview to be made available on NonGNU ELPA: >>> >> https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider/issues/3365 >>> >> >>> >> Since Logview has two dependencies itself, which are not available >>> >> on NonGNU ELPA, and since Bozhidar assured me that it is fine to >>> >> submit multiple packages in one go, the attached patch adds all >>> >> three (Logview, datetime, extmap) at once. Local checks suggest t= hat >>> >> the packages can be built fine. >>>=20 >>> I am a bit confused, why should adding multiple related packages in a >>> single patch be an issue? >>>=20 >>> >> All the packages have been available from MELPA for years and are >>> >> mature projects. They are under active maintenance: even if I don= 't >>> >> often add new features, I respond to reported issues on GitHub and >>> >> write fixes when needed. >>> >> >>> >> I added directory `githooks' to the lists of exclusions even if it >>> >> doesn't yet exist in the dependencies: I will add it there sooner= or >>> >> later anyway. In Logview itself this directory already exists. >>>=20 >>> If possible, please add ".elpaignore" files to the repositories >>> themselves, so that we can void tracking the files in elpa-packages >>> itself. >>>=20 >>> >> Please CC me on any replies, I'm not subscribed to the list. >>>=20 >>> That is a given, don't worry about it. >>>=20 >>> >> Paul >>> >> >>> >> *Attachments:* >>> >> =E2=80=A2 0001-Add-Logview-with-dependencies.patch >=20 --11fb895cddd6450fa1cddd86a1ffafeb Content-Type: text/html;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just bumpi= ng this conversation, as we're still looking for someone to help us appl= y the patch.

On Fri, Jul 7, 2023, at 8:21 = AM, Bozhidar Batsov wrote:


On Thu, Jul 6, 2023, at 10:47 PM, Paul Pogonyshev wrote:
> Without understanding the issue properly, why is there a need for = an external data-time parsing package, if Emacs already comes with funct= ions for parsing timestamps?

For speed. Log= view is aimed at very large logs (megabytes) and also for lazily filteri= ng them on-the-fly, adding/removing filters and so on. Built-in function= s were not fast enough, so I had to create datetime. Also for matching: = there is no standard timestamp format, the library helps me at building = regexs needed to match timestamps in given format and also trying to gue= ss which of many possible formats to use for a particular file.

I didn't create the library just for fun, I sa= w a need for it.

> It appears to use use= this extmap package, which parses binary data?

=
Yes.

> How is this all related to C= IDER?

"This all" is not related to CI= DER, because this is Logview's implementation details. CIDER recently ad= ded some log-related functionality and they'd like to use Logview as the= base for their mode, as far as I understand. They don't need datetime o= r extmap, but according to NonGNU ELPA policy, Logview cannot be added w= ithout its dependencies.

> If possible, = please add ".elpaignore" files to the repositories themselves, so that w= e can void tracking the files in elpa-packages itself.
OK, I will do that if the packages get added to the archive.= Don't want to create files while I'm not sure they would be used for an= ything.

Paul

=
On Thu, 6 Jul 2023 at 19:59, Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net> wrote:

"Bozhidar Batsov" <bozhidar@batsov.dev> writes:

> Thanks for putting the patch together so quickly!
>
> Phillip, can you help us to get it = applied?

Applying the patch is not the issu= e, I am just personally hesitant to
add a bunch of depende= ncies/packages I have never heard about before,
more so be= cause I don't use CIDER, /especially/ when I lack the time to
<= div>properly review them (the argument that a package is "mature on MELP= A"
is rather weak from my experience, especially given the= number of low
quality packages on the archive).
=

Without understanding the issue properly, why is the= re a need for an
external data-time parsing package, if Em= acs already comes with
functions for parsing timestamps?&n= bsp; It appears to use use this extmap
package, which pars= es binary data?  How is this all related to CIDER?
But perhaps I am in a minority here, and we should just app= ly the patch.

> On Thu, Jul 6, 2023, at = 7:14 PM, Paul Pogonyshev wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Bozhidar Batsov, author and maintainer = of CIDER, requested for
>> package Logview to be mad= e available on NonGNU ELPA:
<= div>>>
>> Since Logview has two dependencies i= tself, which are not available
>> on NonGNU ELPA, an= d since Bozhidar assured me that it is fine to
>> su= bmit multiple packages in one go, the attached patch adds all
<= div>>> three (Logview, datetime, extmap) at once. Local checks sug= gest that
>> the packages can be built fine.

I am a bit confused, why should adding multiple re= lated packages in a
single patch be an issue?

>> All the packages have been available from MELP= A for years and are
>> mature projects. They are und= er active maintenance: even if I don't
>> often add = new features, I respond to reported issues on GitHub and
&= gt;> write fixes when needed.
>>
&g= t;> I added directory `githooks' to the lists of exclusions even if i= t
>> doesn't yet exist in the dependencies: I will a= dd it there sooner or
>> later anyway. In Logview it= self this directory already exists.

If poss= ible, please add ".elpaignore" files to the repositories
t= hemselves, so that we can void tracking the files in elpa-packages
itself.

>> Please CC me on a= ny replies, I'm not subscribed to the list.

That is a given, don't worry about it.

>= ;> Paul
>>
>> *Attachments:*<= br>
>>  =E2=80=A2 0001-Add-Logview-with-dependencie= s.patch


--11fb895cddd6450fa1cddd86a1ffafeb--