From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#4638: 23.1; doc string and Elisp manual descriptions of file-attributes Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2009 17:58:15 -0700 Message-ID: <1ECFBF8A2C4348C3B763D29276A04BC5@us.oracle.com> Reply-To: Drew Adams , 4638@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1254704861 9105 80.91.229.12 (5 Oct 2009 01:07:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2009 01:07:41 +0000 (UTC) To: Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Oct 05 03:07:35 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1Muc34-000175-4Z for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 05 Oct 2009 03:07:34 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45739 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Muc33-0002Lp-Sh for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:33 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Muc2m-0002Fc-9s for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:16 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Muc2h-0002Df-Oy for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:15 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=49561 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Muc2h-0002Db-Ev for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:11 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:40430) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Muc2g-0000wp-PD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:11 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n95178il002908; Sun, 4 Oct 2009 18:07:08 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n95159Bf002216; Sun, 4 Oct 2009 18:05:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2009 18:05:09 -0700 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs 2Resent-Date: Mon, 05 Oct 2009 01:05:08 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: report 4638 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B.1254704324546 (code B ref -1); Mon, 05 Oct 2009 01:05:08 +0000 Original-Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 5 Oct 2009 00:58:44 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n950whOs000542 for ; Sun, 4 Oct 2009 17:58:44 -0700 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MubuV-0001T5-1o for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 20:58:43 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MubuP-0001St-IH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 20:58:41 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=52759 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MubuP-0001Sq-E6 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 20:58:37 -0400 Original-Received: from rcsinet11.oracle.com ([148.87.113.123]:40383 helo=rgminet11.oracle.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MubuO-00089p-RD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 20:58:37 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by rgminet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n950xdpD015769 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Mon, 5 Oct 2009 00:59:40 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt356.oracle.com (acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n94NXKmu013142 for ; Mon, 5 Oct 2009 00:59:18 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt021.oracle.com by acsmt355.oracle.com with ESMTP id 20193103071254704284; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 17:58:04 -0700 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/24.5.184.158) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sun, 04 Oct 2009 17:58:04 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcpFVuu8NRWvDEVKT32s8PpsR5RcFA== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090201.4AC944B7.00E9:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Resent-Date: Sun, 04 Oct 2009 21:07:15 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:31679 Archived-At: >From the doc string: 1. Number of links to file. Please state that it is an integer value. 2. File uid as a string or a number. If a string value cannot be looked up, a numeric value, either an integer or a float, is returned. Can we say how long the string is (fixed length or max)? 10. inode number. If inode number is larger than the Emacs integer... Should presumably say "than the _largest_ Emacs integer". Also, #10 contradicts what is said in the Elisp manual, node `File Attributes'. Which is correct? The doc string speaks of a cons cell containing possibly 3 integers. (And how can a single cons cell contain 3 integers? Not clear.) The manual speaks of a (single) cons cell with car and cdr integers. 11. Device number. If it is larger than the Emacs integer, this is a cons cell, similar to the inode number. Again, it should presumably say _largest_ Emacs integer. Also, it's not clear what "device number" means, and the Elisp manual describes this differently, as "the file system number of the file system that the file is in". Neither description is understandable, but they especially do not seem to correspond, at least not in a self-evident way. These desciptions need to be improved, at the very least by referring to the original terminology (UNIX) or reference. The following note is referenced only from #4, but #5 and #6 say "likewise". The note speaks of "access time". It is not clear whether the note applies only to #4 (access time) or also to #5 and #6. If it applies only to #4, then it should just be moved to #4. Otherwise, things should be rephrased to make clear what is meant (not necessarily access time). On some FAT-based filesystems, only the date of last access is recorded, so last access time will always be midnight of that day. It is important to get these descriptions right. How can we expect someone to write code that depends on these values, if s?he cannot even know what forms they can take? In GNU Emacs 23.1.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600) of 2009-07-29 on SOFT-MJASON Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600 configured using `configure --with-gcc (4.4)'