From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bill Wohler Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: toolbar conventions Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:26:20 -0800 Organization: Newt Software Message-ID: <17935.1134851180@olgas.newt.com> References: <19466.1134769009@olgas.newt.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1134851290 6304 80.91.229.2 (17 Dec 2005 20:28:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:28:10 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 17 21:28:03 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EnidX-0002CO-5k for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 21:26:35 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EnieH-0005Ra-Tx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:27:21 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Enie8-0005RE-HL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:27:12 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Enie7-0005Qv-Ol for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:27:12 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Enie7-0005Qs-LR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:27:11 -0500 Original-Received: from [207.69.195.67] (helo=pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Enigk-0002rr-RQ; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:29:55 -0500 Original-Received: from h-68-165-7-242.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net ([68.165.7.242] helo=olgas.newt.com) by pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1EnidJ-0004QE-00; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 15:26:21 -0500 Original-Received: by olgas.newt.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 536F316FE1; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:26:20 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from olgas.newt.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by olgas.newt.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AD3716FAC; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:26:20 -0800 (PST) Original-To: rms@gnu.org In-Reply-To: "Richard M. Stallman"'s message of Sat, 17 Dec 2005 14:40:49 EST. X-Mailer: MH-E 7.85+cvs; nmh 1.1; GNU Emacs 22.0.50.10 X-Image-URL: http://www.newt.com/wohler/images/bill-diving.png X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:47962 Archived-At: Richard M. Stallman wrote: > By the way, I checked both the O'Reilly style guide and the Microsoft > style guide and both agreed on "menu bar" and "toolbar." Given that > technical terms go from two words, to a hyphenated form, to a single > word, it's likely that's what we're seeing here. > > Menu bars are older than tool bars, so if it were simply a natural > progression, it is peculiar that it has proceeded faster for > tool bars than for menu bars. Interesting observation. > Given that, should we be using "toolbar" in both text and code in > anticipation of a future renaming of tool-bar to toolbar? > > I tend to think we should treat the two alike. I think I'd agree. So do we go with "menubar" and "toolbar" in the future, or "menu bar" and "tool bar"? Given the following stats, and because we have menu-bar.el and tool-bar.el already, I'd say the inertia clearly indicates that "menu bar" and "tool bar" would be the desired choices for Emacs. I can add a Style Guide subheading to (elisp)Coding Conventions and (elisp)Documentation Tips and include this information if you like. [wohler@olgas:586]$ grep -ri menubar --exclude \*.elc * --exclude ChangeLog\* --exclude loaddefs.el --exclude ldefs-boot.el| wc 241 2060 23519 [wohler@olgas:587]$ grep -ri menu.bar --exclude \*.elc * --exclude ChangeLog\* --exclude loaddefs.el --exclude ldefs-boot.el| wc 1523 8660 109482 [wohler@olgas:588]$ grep -ri toolbar --exclude \*.elc * --exclude ChangeLog\* --exclude loaddefs.el --exclude ldefs-boot.el| wc 330 2245 30068 [wohler@olgas:589]$ grep -ri tool.bar --exclude \*.elc * --exclude ChangeLog\* --exclude loaddefs.el --exclude ldefs-boot.el| wc 400 2048 26282 > But there is no rush > to change this; let's leave it alone, for now. Agree, but new code should use "menu bar" and "tool bar." How about speedbar though? > Does anyone have any ideas on the issue of how to use the term > "option"? That issue is more important--it is not just an issue of > punctuation, it is inconsistent use of a word. Would someone like to > study the situation and find out which uses occur where? I don't recall this thread. What was the subject? -- Bill Wohler http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD Maintainer of comp.mail.mh FAQ and MH-E. Vote Libertarian! If you're passed on the right, you're in the wrong lane.