From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Jostein=20Kj=C3=B8nigsen?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: windows installer Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2017 12:21:35 +0100 Message-ID: <1510485695.3852253.1169712120.2E2D64A8@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <87po99qzbn.fsf@russet.org.uk> <1509955878.550800.1162811960.541B525D@webmail.messagingengine.com> <87h8u6bae3.fsf@russet.org.uk> <1510126271.1965593.1165373624.0601E5CF@webmail.messagingengine.com> <8760aijcek.fsf@russet.org.uk> <83ineiotjr.fsf@gnu.org> <83h8u1p8vt.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: jostein@kjonigsen.net NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_----------=_151048569638522530" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1510485746 10773 195.159.176.226 (12 Nov 2017 11:22:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2017 11:22:26 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Nov 12 12:22:22 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1eDqLG-0002au-4V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 12:22:22 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48662 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1eDqLN-0002TY-JS for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:22:29 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:57151) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1eDqKd-0002SM-M6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:44 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1eDqKc-0002Xk-JP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:43 -0500 Original-Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.28]:53419) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1eDqKY-0002Uh-J5; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:38 -0500 Original-Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8305B204B0; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:36 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from web4 ([10.202.2.214]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:36 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= secure.kjonigsen.net; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:subject:to:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=7fUNp03GmaMCr63gkesv+aZMtIhdWLh0wXQ07C0oy4w=; b=V6K9aJt5t9Ld oW0u3lXzrbHxyQlKfYVTRU/hXVMG+dzkPHXfJ9Y6017uyrRStLPLIXrNHBRmQY1V Qdds33uZ3BxlZq8E8NfIjiGl7r213u5YUCHL6VTPvNishG5nw/CWy2DlnJQA2aJu 4JoRGxR875JcIOsaykl1nGZzlh2igalf2/mJ4LYD+h3GRa2VJiNA/aQc7y7Kr+Uh CZHPy/LmciKcefwG2xqWIXc3VK4SJR+aWb2RbG/dnBDeJHWJ5ZgjALOW/VSs2efO eGFa7WPD1smX8yv+eEcR6qb5mbk/HPprEBgE/W0t0KDJB6Sd78aqSwAERWWx+Yr+ /7iiU8KWEw== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:subject:to:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=7fUNp03GmaMCr63gkesv+aZMtIhdWLh0wXQ07C0oy4w=; b=n57qL8kimRD8 ZfxUEiMaVCkd9FF/6NS4X/4nsC36N3wHtNRH6RPDkbhJd2SuPwkwdPRVEvNuvwvO VGzd5HS51XhltRS4QpLKc9089dFFxywxRsHjxqpz5Hgp+alrqRPm4iJIp0iwh4XD h/Ppe4ws03t6whTaXkfTTh+wi8EkiV/TVObqSwxAiNprEsCPDtHkxsI6MjTxrwRI QfWjSnJXibq157pD0wAcTBENbfA3SJ7jo+08aMNkV/2EemPX5jK2M0uKI9uMtbZm 6ViuMrHgpHJwlOC8W8+HbU5Id9UPNguL+eCpXaLWO+O38k0sLIY8mWk10Rn4L1na UeQCfdILvw== X-ME-Sender: Original-Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 99) id 510E1BAB38; Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:21:36 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-f89283c9 In-Reply-To: <83h8u1p8vt.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 66.111.4.28 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:220087 Archived-At: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --_----------=_151048569638522530 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" On Sat, Nov 11, 2017, at 08:33 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stefan Monnier >> Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2017 15:46:09 -0500 >>=20 >> For lack of familiarity with the Windows world, I don't know if >> typical>> Windows users will want to add it to PATH (as a GNU/Linux user= , of >> course I'd do that), but I think the "frequently" above is incorrect.> M= aybe I'm missing something. 29 packages (out of 166) in ELPA have a> Makef= ile. Taking just one random Makefile, company/Makefile, I see > this: >=20 > EMACS=3Demacs > [...] >=20 > compile: > ${EMACS} -Q --batch -L . -f batch-byte-compile company.el company- > *.el>=20 > If this Makefile is invoked with "make compile", it clearly expects > Emacs to be found along PATH. And even if Make is invoked from Emacs,> t= he directory where the Emacs binary was found is not added to PATH. > So how can this work without Emacs's binary being on PATH? And what > am I missing here? >=20 Not meaning to come off as any final authority here, but speaking as someone deeply familiar with the Windows-platform (decades user- experience, 10+ MS developer certifications, lalala)... With the clause that I'm not som much a C/C++ kind of guy... The most obvious problem these packages will encounter is that make (GNU make, or any other variant) is typically not installed on regular end- user Windows machines. It's not part of the regular Windows developer toolchain, which typically relies on MSBuild instead. Expecting "make" to be available is something I would consider a portabilit= y- problem *with the package*, and I honestly don't think this is the Emacs- installer's job to put in place. -- Regards Jostein Kj=C3=B8nigsen jostein@kjonigsen.net --_----------=_151048569638522530 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
On Sat, Nov 11, 2017, at 08:33 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2017 15:46:09 -0500

For lack of familiarity with the Windows world, I don't know if typica= l
Windows users will want to add it to PATH (as a GNU/Linux user, of
=
course I'd do that), but I think the "frequently" above is incorrect.<= br>
Maybe I'm missing something.  29 packages (out of 16= 6) in ELPA have a
Makefile.  Taking just one random Makefile, company/Makefile, I s= ee
this:

  EMACS=3Demacs
  [...]

  compile:
  ${EMACS} -Q --batch -L . -f batch-byte-compile company.el compa= ny-*.el

If this Makefile is invoked with "make compile", it clearly expects
Emacs to be found along PATH.  And even if Make is invoked from E= macs,
the directory where the Emacs binary was found is not added to PATH.
So how can this work without Emacs's binary being on PATH?  And w= hat
am I missing here?


Not meaning to come off as any final authority here, but speaking as s= omeone deeply familiar with the Windows-platform (decades user-experience, = 10+ MS developer certifications, lalala)... With the clause that I'm not so= m much a C/C++ kind of guy...

The most obvious problem these packages will encounter is that make (G= NU make, or any other variant) is typically not installed on regular end-us= er Windows machines. It's not part of the regular Windows developer toolcha= in, which typically relies on MSBuild instead.

Expecting "make" to be available is something I would consider a porta= bility-problem with the package, and I honestly don't think this is = the Emacs-installer's job to put in place.

--
Regards
Jostein Kj=C3=B8nigsen

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