From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Karl O. Pinc" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#3540: Please reserve a ctrl-key combination for interoperability Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:46:40 -0500 Message-ID: <1244771200l.4854l.2l@mofo> Reply-To: "Karl O. Pinc" , 3540@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; DelSp=Yes; Format=Flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1244781075 5688 80.91.229.12 (12 Jun 2009 04:31:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 04:31:15 +0000 (UTC) To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jun 12 06:31:12 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1MEyQ3-00070k-Nq for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 12 Jun 2009 06:31:12 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53425 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MEyQ3-0005y0-2S for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:31:11 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MEw1H-0004NT-FF for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:57:27 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MEw1C-0004K0-K8 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:57:26 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=42673 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MEw1C-0004Ju-6k for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:57:22 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:46712) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MEw1B-0006KS-KD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:57:21 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5C1vJJh011626; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:57:19 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n5C1t40K011060; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:55:04 -0700 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: "Karl O. Pinc" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 01:55:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: report 3540 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B.124477121710321 (code B ref -1); Fri, 12 Jun 2009 01:55:04 +0000 Original-Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 12 Jun 2009 01:46:57 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5C1kqQh010315 for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:46:53 -0700 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MEvr2-0006dr-3g for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:46:52 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MEvqw-0006WN-UB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:46:51 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=51086 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MEvqw-0006WC-Q2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:46:46 -0400 Original-Received: from janus.meme.com ([69.17.73.118]:59829 helo=smtp.meme.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MEvqw-0004vI-7w for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:46:46 -0400 Original-Received: by smtp.meme.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 5BE2A20135; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:46:44 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: from mofo.meme.com (unknown [192.168.1.2]) by smtp.meme.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6530920117 for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:46:43 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: from mofo (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mofo.meme.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D84A43C6E for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:46:43 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: Balsa 2.3.13 Content-Disposition: inline X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Resent-Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:57:26 -0400 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:30:49 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:28661 Archived-At: Hello, I want emacs to keep one control key combination unbound so that emacs can be run inside other programs that need an escape character to enter a control mode. Examples of such programs are screen and minicom. Screen is a full-screen window manager that multiplexes a physical terminal between several processes (typically interactive shells). Minicom is a serial communication program, a terminal emulator. It is difficult to use emacs inside such programs because these programs (by default) bind a commonly used emacs control key sequence as their escape key. Emacs users should be able to re-configure such programs to use an unbound emacs ctrl keypress. Sure, each emacs user could chose their own key combination (I used ctrl-\, but I recently upgraded from emacs 21 and see it's now bound in emacs 22), but this makes it almost impossible to, e.g., publish tutorials/recipies on how to use, say, screen, with emacs. The person following the tutorial might need the particular emacs feature that is no longer bound to the standard emacs key combination. As things stand emacs users have a bar over which they must jump to use such useful programs as screen; each user must figure out what emacs keypress they wish to sacrifice, taking into account the key combinations used by screen at a time when they are unfamiliar with screen. At minimum if a control key combination was reserved the choice would be obvious, at best either emacs or the screen documentation would describe what configuration and usage changes were necessary to allow the two programs to interoperate. Frankly, Ctrl-\ was perfect because it was not otherwise bound in either screen or minicom. The choice of a key that's already bound in these programs means that yet more reconfiguration of screen/minicom must be done to retain functionality, the lost functionality must be bound to a non-standard key. This introduces yet more incompatibility between emacs users and the rest of the universe. Thank you for your time. Karl Free Software: "You don't pay back, you pay forward." -- Robert A. Heinlein