From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?iso-8859-1?b?Suly9G1l?= Marant Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [jerome.marant@free.fr: Re: Possible help with stable Emacs releases.] Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 09:22:53 +0200 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <1096615373.415d05cde9dfe@imp1-q.free.fr> References: <1096291271.415813c757a26@imp6-q.free.fr> <20040927134714.GA20012@fencepost> <87hdphx91c.fsf@trouble.defaultvalue.org> <87655wswkv.fsf@trouble.defaultvalue.org> <01c4a6f8$Blat.v2.2.2$f6ef61c0@zahav.net.il> <20040930143404.GB2296@fencepost> <01c4a703$Blat.v2.2.2$9a627220@zahav.net.il> <1096559619.415c2c031623c@imp4-q.free.fr> <01c4a707$Blat.v2.2.2$99a73ba0@zahav.net.il> <1096576951.415c6fb768430@imp3-q.free.fr> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1096616446 29984 80.91.229.6 (1 Oct 2004 07:40:46 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 07:40:46 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , rlb@defaultvalue.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 01 09:40:33 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1CDI1o-0007iN-00 for ; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 09:40:32 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CDI8E-0004t7-Or for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:47:10 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CDI7v-0004sd-8M for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:46:51 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1CDI7s-0004rw-8V for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:46:49 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CDI7r-0004rb-V3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:46:48 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.41.8] (helo=mx20.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.34) id 1CDI1H-00067J-OJ; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:39:59 -0400 Original-Received: from [213.228.0.62] (helo=postfix4-1.free.fr) by mx20.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CDHsb-0001hi-Fg; Fri, 01 Oct 2004 03:31:01 -0400 Original-Received: from imp1-q.free.fr (imp1-q.free.fr [212.27.42.1]) by postfix4-1.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A5D81F31BF; Fri, 1 Oct 2004 09:22:54 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: by imp1-q.free.fr (Postfix, from userid 33) id 18DAB369F2; Fri, 1 Oct 2004 09:22:54 +0200 (MEST) Original-Received: from mure.msy.sagem.com (mure.msy.sagem.com [62.160.59.178]) by imp1-q.free.fr (IMP) with HTTP for ; Fri, 1 Oct 2004 09:22:53 +0200 Original-To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.5 X-Originating-IP: 62.160.59.178 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:27776 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:27776 Quoting Stefan Monnier : > >> I think the issue of whether we can do 2 or not is mostly irrelevant= : > >> if the pretests take too much time, then we necessarily won't make t= hem > >> more often. I.e. if it works it works and if it doesn't, then it wo= rks > >> as before. I don't see what's to discuss. > > > But if people think this change in the management of bugfix releases > > is a good thing, aren't they going to do everything for it to succeed= ? > > Let's clarify: we do propose to add more manpower for doing the > > "dirty job" (honestly, noone loves tracking bugs), but it will never > > work without a little cooperation from Emacs developers. > > Can I have a guaranty that I'll never be pissed off or ignored on > > blocking situations? ("go fuck yourself! You wanted to do the job, > > you'll have to do this without us!") > > I don't expect any such problem. The worst I expect is that you might > sometimes be prevented from installing a bugfix because it's not "good > enough" (which is something that happens all the time anyway). > Also sometimes things won't go as fast as you'd like. I've told many time that we won't apply patches without emacs-devel consents. Usually, by reading the list, you'll notice that we often forward bug reports and patches to the list. Sometimes we write patches ourselves for our users. > In order for you not to be frustrated, I think the best option is to ta= ke it > slow: after all, the process already exists, and you're just offering t= o > help out, so you can start by just systematically submitting the patche= s > that you'd like to apply to Debian's tree (so they get installed in RC)= , > then regularly bug people to remind them that we should get the next pr= etest > started, ... Ok, I see. You are worried about giving CVS access to people with a too low level of trust. Well, no matter. The less I do, the more you have to. Maybe will you manage to prove that it's not worth it because it requires too much manpower from emacs-devel. As I said, we are already doing the work of collecting patches (backporti= ng, and testing) for our users. -- J=E9r=F4me Marant