From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Joe Kelsey Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: skeleton.el _ versus @ Date: 09 Apr 2003 17:00:03 -0700 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <1049932803.419.9.camel@zircon> References: <200303242005.h2OK57gr013285@rum.cs.yale.edu> <1048554010.20622.66.camel@zircon> <200303311740.h2VHeZNG017518@rum.cs.yale.edu> <1049242082.66437.15.camel@zircon> <200304020020.h320K4de023432@rum.cs.yale.edu> <1049245381.66437.33.camel@zircon> <20030403084549.2a5aca76.occitan@esperanto.org> <200304091626.h39GQlwc000430@rum.cs.yale.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1049933027 24586 80.91.224.249 (10 Apr 2003 00:03:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 00:03:47 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 10 02:03:45 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 193PXd-0006OP-00 for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 02:03:45 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 193PcL-0000RV-00 for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 02:08:37 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 193PVo-0007lW-02 for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 20:01:52 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 193PVH-0007GH-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 20:01:19 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 193PV0-00071x-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 20:01:03 -0400 Original-Received: from dsl231-043-165.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net ([216.231.43.165] helo=zircon.seattle.wa.us) by monty-python.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 193PU8-0006TE-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 20:00:08 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 14190 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 00:00:03 -0000 Original-Received: from localhost (HELO ?127.0.0.1?) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 00:00:03 -0000 Original-To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: <200304091626.h39GQlwc000430@rum.cs.yale.edu> X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.4 Original-cc: rms@gnu.org Original-cc: Daniel Pfeiffer X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:13092 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:13092 On Wed, 2003-04-09 at 09:26, Stefan Monnier wrote: > > But then going and changing it incompatibly a few years later, breaking > > existing skeletons is a behaviour worthy of the Bushs and Saddams of this > > world! At the very least this should be advertised to all those concerned, > > and help offered in fixing the skeletons this breaks! > > I actually did look around and didn't find any skeleton where the > change introduced problems. Then (while pretesting 21.1) someone > pointed out a case where the new behavior was not as good > as before (the position of point after insertion was fine but > the fact that the first @ had not been put on skeleton-positions > was a problem), which I addressed (by adding the position to > skeleton-positions even when it also sets position-point). These are all very weak excuses. The fact is, you *broke it* in an incompatible way. If you want this behavior, fork out skeleton.el from the distribution and install it as a personal package. The only reason you couldn't find skeletons which broke is beacuse you did not look farther than the core sources. If you had been an mmm-mode user, you would have noticed the bad behavior immediately. I formally request atht this bad change be withdrawn from the sources. Stefan can install his own personal version on his own personal machine. /Joe