From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Upcoming merge of adaptive-wrap Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2024 18:56:46 +0200 Message-ID: <063e35f8-5920-4899-8b48-2a86c524b70e@gutov.dev> References: <878r4eqjh8.fsf.ref@yahoo.com> <878r4eqjh8.fsf@yahoo.com> <875xzgookd.fsf@yahoo.com> <1e6f618f-5572-40e4-addb-016b467def37@gutov.dev> <87il3gn89u.fsf@yahoo.com> <87bk98n3l3.fsf@yahoo.com> <37bf6ee2-3bc0-49e8-aa55-70c77b6c5bf2@gutov.dev> <87a5orl95m.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="19286"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, Stephen Berman To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 27 17:58:00 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rTm0E-0004jI-TX for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; 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Sat, 27 Jan 2024 11:56:49 -0500 (EST) Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <87a5orl95m.fsf@yahoo.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.147.123.24; envelope-from=dmitry@gutov.dev; helo=wout1-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -26 X-Spam_score: -2.7 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_SBL_A=0.1 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:315492 Archived-At: On 27/01/2024 05:58, Po Lu wrote: > Dmitry Gutov writes: > >> But would they, largely? You actually have to visit the directory >> which hosts NEWS on your system (where is it installed to?), mark all >> previous NEWS files and do the search. That's non-trivial. > > Is this meant to imply that selecting "Help -> Emacs News", then typing > `C-x d' is non-trivial? What about reading the manual, or any other of > Emacs's built-in facilities for assisting users? It's an order of a magnitude more involved than 'M-x list-packages' followed by C-s. > When users are stumped, their first reactions are to reach for the > documentation, be that the manual, apropos or NEWS. Through Google -- maybe. > It also stands to reason that users outside the first two categories are > more inclined to take to a search engine, and to them this thread will > be more enlightening than the package menu ever will. Because its title is a good match for whatever the user would search for? What would they search for, BTW? >> If you sit every user behind a screen and force them to read either of >> the texts entirely, sure. But that's not how it usually works. > > [...] > >> It's a good explanation (easier to understand than the summary, I >> agree), but I'm curious what would you improve in the summary to make >> it more recognizable. Any particular keywords? From where I'm >> standing, even after reading the description, all the important ones >> seem to be there: "wrap", "adaptive", "line-wrapping", "wrap-prefix". > > I never proposed to improve the summary, since in my opinion, the > current package description is already the optimum under the limitations > of its format. You renamed the package to visual-wrap, so perhaps the term "visual" could help (instead of "smart"?). There's also a mistake in the description now: visual-fill-mode does not exist. >> Even if you're reading the NEWS, you probably don't carefully scan >> every entry, so there must be some particular words which might have >> piqued your interest in the way that the current summary does not. > > The mental effort required to understand the NEWS and the documentation > I installed is so little that, truly, the only words left to be said are > "there are none so blind as those who will not see", assuming that the > reader is searching for this feature. The issue is not reading a particular NEWS entry, but finding it.