From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Review a blog post about emacs-devel Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2020 19:42:03 +0300 Message-ID: <01d7c1b8-446c-dcfc-b6ea-f04c93bb4bba@yandex.ru> References: <2D56B465-C028-41AE-8D07-38C1C49FF5F7@gmail.com> <04ADB630-EE50-450D-B7EC-DD115C242500@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="78986"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.7.0 Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Yuan Fu , Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 30 18:58:22 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jUCVx-000KPn-8C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 18:58:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53650 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUCVw-0002px-AO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 12:58:20 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:53694) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUCV6-0002LJ-Uh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 12:57:29 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUCV5-0001E4-RK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 12:57:28 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wm1-x330.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::330]:38560) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUCGH-00010u-Gz; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 12:42:09 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wm1-x330.google.com with SMTP id g12so2725774wmh.3; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 09:42:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Uxa8/7/M5NiWk0WMFHO+KfQ9ANPldzi3hF6s9hzw1WQ=; b=pQ3hPzuBL10iWGu4ZStVYxgPH3mqZGZTwij9bdbr7bCTvmw0xFQPAKENd4VqjLKopU i7nK1XTOyPmfZeAGIARXruXsmLZZtR6oWizBUF/BoRTWdCaTANVYYZuVMMba1dOkb6W4 kvACuY1SX688I3H/or11IxjS26vz+fo7lyNUAHOgy+VNaIRptCBpEhWq24vqq5zRDOgn xQMRxy/ouu5WpvZcIa/KFeCnPBFjQGzPAd6xMt4wf+VqeFkKxtNbb9I/x/cbVMbreZAa i1hFq6Co8NSIIqVO/HF80KwLEPCtuePHNlSJn2nbLWtvIKUYzkXn5dR/MT2ZRwvS7eG8 yhFw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Uxa8/7/M5NiWk0WMFHO+KfQ9ANPldzi3hF6s9hzw1WQ=; b=a37LAoHVRjx2QPVVRl0PAOC7XRTVXQA482hG/JyZxdMRLg0wmwRaZbAD2h4E3TYEFC PVjkzoBftoXS+HWo4HyZ76smTJs+AzB1q3EbhsMv1qT5tEYQ4nf5TDiaFnbnVxt3htaf NSLQtsWH5XmPYUKhkoHqnRSAz0d7v7r9oj6L/j/CDBXpnXsEUuKpXN7FKxq8F5L2vfed 8zR/YTz+2vSL4UgliReLjt7CyTE5PfTi45SlYQtZ97FDJAL6bf/HJoNilTjV2/GEvZMY CsZdEXmpQ81sicWhmxlTsYM+cWbZ/FU4cKGFpm+hdu9/dLA6PbW+ADIq0STDIspI5Gah T6vw== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuYGhsebFMK1kGD/s6XwGn5oqYAUjphEecVmKFIE7DMPo0MGU+CS VD/m8pLiPsVyCvlC6cy1mI5i0m3/FoU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypJ72z+6FMj7eOyZ3DJHd++vwNBmt4D93awFXQRj3VyhROQRtMy48K/IceXx7Z0OqV+UAw5dgg== X-Received: by 2002:a7b:c7d6:: with SMTP id z22mr4150942wmk.73.1588264926157; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 09:42:06 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.3] ([66.205.73.129]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id q10sm332749wrv.95.2020.04.30.09.42.04 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 30 Apr 2020 09:42:05 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <04ADB630-EE50-450D-B7EC-DD115C242500@gmail.com> Content-Language: en-US Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::330; envelope-from=raaahh@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x330.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: [-] PROGRAM ABORT : Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). Location : parse_addr6(), p0f-client.c:67 X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:4864:20::330 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248250 Archived-At: Hi Yuan, On 30.04.2020 18:19, Yuan Fu wrote: >> On Apr 29, 2020, at 10:28 PM, Richard Stallman wrote: >> >> [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] >> [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] >> [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] >> >> Would you please talk about "free software" or "libre software", not >> "open source”? >> [...] >> Also, please don't use GitHub as a standard of comparison. That would >> promote GitHub, which is counter to what we aim to do. >> > > I removed “open source” since it’s not the main subject. I used GitHub as a comparison because it _is_ the most familiar workflow right now. I don’t think admitting the fact promotes GitHub. Also I wouldn’t say I used GitHub as a standard as comparison, but simply as another well-known workflow. Here is my edited first paragraph: > > Emacs, /the/ editor we all use and love, has been running for decades, receiving contribution from hundreds of hackers along the way. Because it predates recent popular workflows (a.k.a GitHub and friends) by many years, you can’t do the usual thing—open issues, fork and make PR’s, etc. However, Emacs’s development workflow isn’t as tedious and difficult as many people imagines (in particular, you don’t need Gnus or deal with email in Emacs, or setup anything fancy). > > >> Please don't promote Emacs Lisp packages that we don't have papers >> to include in Emacs or GNU ELPA. That includes Magit. >> > > I think we should promote all free software, non-selectively. Maybe the freedom of Magit is less secure because Jonas haven’t signed the assignment (yet); but I don’t think it’s enough difference to treat Magit differently. These are good counter-points, so I think it's just fine if you make your post without honoring some of Richard's requests. Swapping "open source" for "free software" is a good thing to do, though.