From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Alexandrov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: N-key rollover keyboards Date: Mon, 03 Aug 2020 21:17:42 +0300 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="18191"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: help-gnu-emacs , Yuri Khan To: Alan Davis Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Aug 03 20:21:09 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1k2f5B-0004dO-6Z for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 03 Aug 2020 20:21:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48520 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k2f59-00020W-T6 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 03 Aug 2020 14:21:08 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48646) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k2f25-0001dp-C3 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 03 Aug 2020 14:17:57 -0400 Original-Received: from relay-1.mailobj.net ([213.182.54.6]:53675) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k2f22-0002VN-Le for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 03 Aug 2020 14:17:56 -0400 Original-Received: from v-1c.localdomain (unknown [192.168.90.161]) by relay-1.mailobj.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 62C63117D; Mon, 3 Aug 2020 20:17:49 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: by mail-1.net-c.com [213.182.54.15] with ESMTP Mon, 3 Aug 2020 20:17:49 +0200 (CEST) X-EA-Auth: yUuyYBiJt8UMeKgNxiCHM9/tGrCmLsb9ac8MFF2JCqqAmstPT71CK9hilxSPUNCgeXlFon4RmJ5C9zhEnKNmdPLsC58AniP5 In-Reply-To: (Alan Davis's message of "Sun, 2 Aug 2020 10:47:33 -0700") OpenPGP: id=525F7E60AD812C2361752BB4C8B0F8548EE7F3E7; url=https://openpgpkey.gnui.org/.well-known/openpgpkey/gnui.org/hu/hr4k5tkxm6shwdc18su4bkm34w3dctjd Mail-Copies-To: always Received-SPF: pass client-ip=213.182.54.6; envelope-from=dag@gnui.org; helo=relay-1.mailobj.net X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/08/03 14:17:49 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.1-3.10 X-Spam_score_int: -28 X-Spam_score: -2.9 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:123627 Archived-At: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alan Davis wrote: > On Sun, Aug 2, 2020, 10:04 Dmitry Alexandrov wrote: >> FWIW, N-key rollover is not really about USB or protocols; it=CA=BCs abo= ut circuit of the keyboard. >> >> It does matter, when you reconfigure modifiers in a human-friendly way, = that is move one of the =E2=80=98controls=E2=80=99 (normally, the left one)= closer to =E2=80=98space=E2=80=99 =E2=80=94 under your thumb =E2=80=94 (ct= rl:swap_lalt_lctl setxkbmap(1) -option or equivalent). >> >> Then, on many ordinary keyboards few combinations, that are in use in Em= acs, are indeed get =E2=80=98ghosted=E2=80=99. And M-C-b with inner M- and= C- is a very likely variant. >> >> Two-key chords can never be affected, of course. > > 'ghosted'? Yes. https://www.bing.com/search?q=3Dkey+ghosting > Does this mean these apparently problematic combinations require N-key ro= llover? No, not necessary. Much cheaper redesign of a circuit would suffice. > I am also using org-mode with several multiple-key chords. I cannot reme= mber any instance where these have been a problem. So, evidently, either your keyboards are not affected or you=CA=BCve just n= ever bumped into affected chords. Do an exhaustive check, if you are conce= rned: (while t (let ((key (read-key))) (message "%s: ok\n" (format-kbd-macro (vector key))) (when (eql ?\C-g key) (keyboard-quit)))) --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iIMEARYIACsWIQRSX35grYEsI2F1K7TIsPhUjufz5wUCXyhUxg0cZGFnQGdudWku b3JnAAoJEMiw+FSO5/PnO6YBALhJEBCfHAMN3dgJfQkMZnKq85AYbCE35ujMGT+h 3BWRAQC1zuCWJfSlCY70cyAKVx22EbktGG4ws17xvoDAMwCTAg== =oxJ+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--