From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Oliver Scholz Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Is Emacs on Aqua crippleware or is it just broken? Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 19:34:34 +0200 Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+gnu-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Message-ID: References: <39d9c156.0305042200.1639a252@posting.google.com> <39d9c156.0305060558.7cba26d9@posting.google.com> <060520030745372240%jerrykindall@nospam.invalid> <39d9c156.0305070815.6d4bfaa@posting.google.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1052329914 25756 80.91.224.249 (7 May 2003 17:51:54 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 17:51:54 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+gnu-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed May 07 19:51:46 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19DSym-00067i-00 for ; Wed, 07 May 2003 19:45:20 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 19DSuV-0000lz-06 for gnu-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 07 May 2003 13:40:55 -0400 Original-Path: shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.vmunix.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!dialin-145-254-192-215.arcor-ip.NET!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help,comp.sys.mac.apps Original-Lines: 41 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: dialin-145-254-192-215.arcor-ip.net (145.254.192.215) Original-X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1052328942 18702334 145.254.192.215 (16 [87814]) X-Attribution: os X-Face: "HgH2sgK|bfH$; PiOJI6|qUCf.ve<51_Od(%ynHr?=>znn#~#oS>",F%B8&\vus),2AsPYb -n>PgddtGEn}s7kH?7kH{P_~vu?]OvVN^qD(L)>G^gDCl(U9n{:d>'DkilN!_K"eNzjrtI4Ya6;Td% IZGMbJ{lawG+'J>QXPZD&TwWU@^~A}f^zAb[Ru;CT(UA]c& User-Agent: Gnus/5.090019 (Oort Gnus v0.19) Emacs/21.3.50 (windows-nt) Cancel-Lock: sha1:og7OWjO5CpGOTg8nWQgI26PGvWs= Original-Xref: shelby.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:112900 comp.sys.mac.apps:360793 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+gnu-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:9395 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:9395 bk_usenet@yahoo.co.uk (BK) writes: > Jerry Kindall wrote ... > >> > On the Mac, HIG is the local custom and therefore it is only >> > reasonable to expecrt that any foreign application coming to Mac land >> > can will respect the native customs and accept them as being normal, >> > while its own foreign customs, although they might be accepted, will >> > remain foreign. >> >> No, you've got it backwards. When you launch Emacs, you tell your Mac >> "I want to travel to Emacs-land" and implicitly accept its foreign >> customs. > > In other words it's a gateway/compatibility application. Fair enough, > I don't necessarily have a problem with that view, but the issue > Mr.Scholz raised was purely about my choice of language when I > referred to Apple style keyboard shortcuts. Therefore, my response was > only supposed to address his objection to my chosing the word > "normal". It was not meant to suggest that anyone can conclude from > this that the Emacs shortcuts are wrong or bad or inacceptable. > > The point was that on a Mac, it will have to be permissible to call > Apple style shortcuts "normal" without being flamed for that choice of > language. [...] To clarify: It wasn't only the use of the word "normal" in the sense of "what I expect when I launch an application on Mac OS" that provoked me to write the article you are referring to. In this sense "C-x/C-c/C-v" are indeed normal on Mac OS. But I do have to admit that this was not necessarily obvious from my posting. And I do have to admit that it is a possible interpretation of the actual words I chose, to read it that way. So it was my fault that I didn't really explain what I meant in the first place. Oliver -- 18 Floréal an 211 de la Révolution Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité!