From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Christopher Dimech Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Morally equivalent Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2022 01:17:56 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87y1tfzhzm.fsf@undisclosedlocation.com> <877d0zfjqa.fsf@web.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="37545"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Michael Heerdegen Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Oct 17 01:19:58 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1okCvG-0009b3-KG for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 17 Oct 2022 01:19:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44094 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1okCvF-0000ZF-78 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2022 19:19:57 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44118) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1okCtP-0000XZ-Vm for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2022 19:18:07 -0400 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:35705) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1okCtL-0008SP-Sr for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2022 19:18:02 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1665962276; bh=DZjs34EtUX5RLQ83bh4NGG8OvV2UKXS/AWax3SVdnc0=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:References; b=fsoNrPgmXbqXB1p14lGnZg1sPLqhxWmVItlu2tnY7THJN49rE/IMd0lWiQcWNfDGo IZCfmBzZQRVZHo4uzve78BuF5iVGZs9fkyfZwbPppuPS2M2mrB+f3VIAhoz2P1ciGH OpoNInURGop9eXKwfjeZ1JnBY+1qWmPlFIW+Z7NQ= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Original-Received: from [92.251.127.164] ([92.251.127.164]) by web-mail.gmx.net (3c-app-mailcom-bs10.server.lan [172.19.170.178]) (via HTTP); Mon, 17 Oct 2022 01:17:56 +0200 Importance: normal Sensitivity: Normal In-Reply-To: <877d0zfjqa.fsf@web.de> X-UI-Message-Type: mail X-Priority: 3 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:WQ5z8IBn3UBYlX0CbWhT41ejfcAPyxkXU/4QdZqy3lNMGFXSGr5FarBtLespZt7aW5/wr ZCPH2JF2IoZ7aS8Vg/wHzPdzzLbmIcsb4CtDrVCVjpb/Mp57TMf6SBkf0u+Y5CNTSK3HU1hJ3KGO jvOOeveAkeZaJAD+dDGFgqNtQtsoI8oRh9IjXBVCmG2xqXRA2p72SHClQyQPMlc6NdI85UQoH/gl V/7g8LEryqT21ngyaieIhvz7dPeRf9W//zcVX6G1xjmXKwedqOMSr31HBcAw5cuNVhhyFQvwJubQ uE= X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:r7MEIssocys=:GubqcCaVpb78fLotDv86yQ JYjU6/ptOr5pma1VS0RN7iryVYwt9idORcrihB9Fbe/8OA2j9xPt53hYnntFV9gi+yX+xM7kL ki95w+i3Pl/6SY0P3JNfL3Dv5oastnHpiaRvdXh0CN0GRnJNZV28ZxZxvolczWAwUk+qas1P2 mmRTbT+QX0MTR4aqAtw7uMrpNkFreN4nX4/7KPGcSKeVLmr3OuONGp0Ba39Y1WfWzDFw1snpQ hhHzCEU3my1tB1SYCx5O/hGuZlNZZtQKf/mh7RbefTx96wMp/jTkem4zZab0YlWwEfPJa3ZEv DUmJp1kymjdi55AKdtvIRqCS91L0H2zyLZuantWjBfNkAbSfSvWY6o1qbqlw+vhuUbSYIPCwl 7PeX1d19qNsbk/rnOYC0AzI+4ytoEqTraLYveRIsWe4SacT3dQGSc3CExfpeHe8qaiegNKIt+ 37YKN39tDukb0BYz1p1oNFSbmK78BqmYgCVW+YG+68prikXp9LW1v4A2P07wcf3Y9w2XStwzR NwBM/VvjKvSItbJUTq+Qk2muTyUmudg62XV0EAU0T6paAq2wDBECDJ0Mb5ieGYWxRCzj/qAAn lT6UEjvrNxLC7czmXqJ0cqkZ+tjclNBtNwuhZnapCypyWnvLjKMDDKtklXnbY1XUswI9KDGfw VIXoV8NRj568juLbE4W8p2OtkMMMbi8pAa2PikUaEPIOMuUlmVWMa94jsvCbQStOWypoCou1P 6ViFZeff8Uw4xDW6QMPYqad2zWzhHFm+I+gYvSnZMJMNpDz7vbwkY7hOq8qogmbCPhWxgqq0 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.15.15; envelope-from=dimech@gmx.com; helo=mout.gmx.net X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:140018 Archived-At: > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2022 at 11:10 AM > From: "Michael Heerdegen" > To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org > Subject: Re: Morally equivalent > > Christopher Dimech writes: > > > It is just political nonsense pushed into software. An introductory > > textbook for beginning undergraduates is never serious. And even > > if it was serious, morality does not work. Either it is equivalent, > > or it is not. There is no morality in it. > > I was not familiar with that term (doesn't appear in German) but > understood the doc perfectly. OTOH, if the text said > > This is not equivalent to (setf PLACE (cons NEWELT PLACE)) > > I would not have understood (and it is _not_ equivalent). > > Until someone comes with a better wording we should stop the > Stefan-bashing. Read it as "equivalent in some sense", and good. It's > a text, ok, not a computer program controlling the city traffic. > > Michael. The problem was about the wording, if it turns out Stefan wrote it, then he is not above anybody else. The problem is that in some important ways, things are not precise. And users do not like that.