From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Lennart Borgman" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs's popularity Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 01:53:39 +0100 Message-ID: References: <2103fd36-c5cd-4e8d-a74f-34697a369934@a26g2000prf.googlegroups.com> <87skop8cc7.fsf@iki.fi> <20081215210907.GB3848@groll.co.za> <87ljuh86il.fsf@iki.fi> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1229388853 9926 80.91.229.12 (16 Dec 2008 00:54:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 00:54:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: "Richard Riley" Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Dec 16 01:55:18 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LCODS-0006q8-Bx for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 16 Dec 2008 01:55:15 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51301 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LCOCG-000789-9j for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:54:00 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LCOBy-000784-Pm for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:53:42 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LCOBy-00077s-91 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:53:42 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=53553 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LCOBy-00077p-5y for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:53:42 -0500 Original-Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com ([72.14.220.158]:26118) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LCOBx-0004zM-Ir for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:53:41 -0500 Original-Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id l26so1439793fgb.30 for ; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:53:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=p+H+Oz/LX/WyfCf0T0Arz+058XN+1XvgVH8i9A2v6PY=; b=b93FnbxP4M86HUKc9FPr8hn/vvYgsVHd79xeUgtMFVNnLaG+c4ss1dMv8DE4qbcODM K8kINVpanm8toG/wCptFgfrOBcEIsGm3A6kDHtgNOLOnxLvK28H1jZXjNVwxmx5By/SI J/JYyRCw+x/fpDXbZUwKgS8MyPvxaadvbxk8k= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=x40wzPJ4TSQx7cLhBYQhFSOGh/GzIvSELnbrSSmnypiSaMmMLHXRhf0KL6r6MiQhFC KVjcy6D5RDiy/cNnVq7ZOv6gh1EKYAZPX+i3uhvDrmWeLU6Ohu0p5Efyuq7D+gj78cp7 g30rcwtJdiTtRqEo3kakUF1F14qeFQPWK4+oo= Original-Received: by 10.86.92.7 with SMTP id p7mr4186316fgb.24.1229388819997; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:53:39 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.86.74.11 with HTTP; Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:53:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: Content-Disposition: inline X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:60661 Archived-At: On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 12:40 AM, Richard Riley wrote: > "Lennart Borgman" writes: > >> On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 11:28 PM, Richard Riley wrote: >> >>>>> But Vim is not only installed; it's really used a lot. In Debian Vim has >>>>> always been a bit more popular than Emacs but in the first half of 2007 >>>>> Vim really got popular (around Vim 7.1 and Debian 4.0 release). This >>>>> "used actively" graph compares vim-common, emacs21-bin-common and >>>>> emacs22-bin-common packages: >>>>> >>>>> http://preview.tinyurl.com/5thmmx >>>> >>>> That is a bit strange since the vi emulator Viper in Emacs is now so good. >>>> >>> >>> Not strange at all Lennart, Why would someone run the Emacs OS to run >>> emulated vim when they can run the real thing in 100th of the >>> footprint? >> >> Exactly why do you think the footprint matter? > > Are you serious? Well, yes. I did not even mention that you greatly exaggerated the footprint differences. > Memory usage, start speed, response, and all thinks linked. I actually do not think those are the problem. A barebone Emacs starts up very fast. But start up time may still be a trouble when doing small editing. Of course if you know about Emacs client/server that is not a problem in most cases (though someone gave an example with su that would not work in this case). > And with the boom in netbooks and OSen on USB sticks, emacs finds itself > more and more pushed into that "heavy dinosaur" category. I'm not saying > I *agree* with it, just those are my observations. I checked my Emacs+EmacsW32 directory tree. It is about 160 MB. I am planning to buy a netbook with about 160 GB disk. And hopefully 2 GB memory. > Personally I detest Vi and clones. >