From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Gregory Heytings Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: not good proposal: "C-z " reserved for users Date: Thu, 11 Feb 2021 08:45:00 +0000 Message-ID: References: <87y2fv2g5o.fsf@robertthorpeconsulting.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="16812"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Robert Thorpe Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Feb 11 09:46:36 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lA7cS-0004Hu-40 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 11 Feb 2021 09:46:36 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37136 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lA7cR-0003l2-62 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 11 Feb 2021 03:46:35 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38078) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lA7b4-0003iO-93 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Feb 2021 03:45:10 -0500 Original-Received: from heytings.org ([95.142.160.155]:46210) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lA7ay-0001vv-9b for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Feb 2021 03:45:09 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=heytings.org; s=20210101; t=1613033101; bh=k91MtNstf6dEtezRzNhcRYtdd6u1f7QTSOtgV0bmwEM=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:References:From; b=f1ROdH7kqY1AozPb4pmQ9ie0He2grE9RK2vDArBRCyECAZy0qA7K47Mot+WUAnwpv 7W6ONWv9+MNgMUfD7tgaMhWUx4vcxCVkBbjB1rmZMQC77PJsVK6LApA57pyDFBv7T7 r1s2ohQ+1YaNGJi4j8hj9vLRkEkNGizecymFMs+XOLa+n5KmHwXInnd9X3mhzEkHji m/+Ae+8F6IjCBbbMcG7zsuB7rndjSIGhOyi1B3fFQwROYJwmYt5oMPOv2YP7FTxNxx cQf1AutVeGxRKnNFa2Owu/n+QHk6hVjXEyOp9bsMF9RmkGGOrknholGGiIWO6oTOra FsUco4Cw/z5CA== In-Reply-To: <87y2fv2g5o.fsf@robertthorpeconsulting.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=95.142.160.155; envelope-from=gregory@heytings.org; helo=heytings.org X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:127803 Archived-At: > > There is another issue.... I'm not sure that third-party packages will > use the feature. I'm also on the Reddit Emacs group. Several of the > people there use and develop third-party packages. It seems to me that > they often do that because they don't want to contribute to core. Some > don't like the core Emacs development team and don't agree with their > direction for Emacs. So, would they use such a prefix key if it were > offered? Perhaps not. > > It woud be a feature for those 3rd-party package authors who want to > co-operate with the core Emacs devs. I don't know how many of those > there are, but I doubt it's all of them. > It would be part of the key binding conventions. Of course nobody is forced to follow these conventions, nobody is fined if the don't, but AFAICS the vast majority of package developers do follow them. Those who dislike the core Emacs development team do care about their users, and would not want to make their life more complicated than necessary. > > Like Jean Louis, I think that the suggestion of changing C-z is awful. I > use it all the time. Like Jean said it's expected in Unix like > environments. > As has been explained again and again, including in the post to which you are replying, "C-z C-z" would remain bound to "suspend-frame", all you'd have to do is to press three keys instead of two. That isn't "awful", especially for a command you don't use once a minute. And in case you personally really need "suspend-frame" on "C-z", you would of course always have the possibility to (global-set-key (kbd "C-z") 'suspend-frame), and to move the keymap(s) reserved for third-party libraries on some other key of your choice. > > Of the keys suggested I think the best is "M-o" since it's current > default binding isn't very useful. > A meta key alone wouldn't be an appealing solution for third-party developers, it must either a control key alone, or a control key and its corresponding meta key.