From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Gene Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Where is Emacs Lisp taught ? Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2018 19:11:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <5B8BFDC9-A07B-48FE-8C97-1BB0B84E5577@gmail.com> <53705d26-8a69-4453-aed9-ab72a0cd139e@googlegroups.com> <87woq2ewza.fsf@portable.galex-713.eu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1540692803 19437 195.159.176.226 (28 Oct 2018 02:13:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2018 02:13:23 +0000 (UTC) Injection-Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2018 02:11:12 +0000 User-Agent: G2/1.0 To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 28 03:13:19 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gGaZp-0004wS-BY for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 28 Oct 2018 03:13:17 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38468 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gGabv-00085z-Nf for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 27 Oct 2018 22:15:27 -0400 X-Received: by 2002:ad4:40c7:: with SMTP id x7mr8166493qvp.33.1540692672902; Sat, 27 Oct 2018 19:11:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:ac8:291b:: with SMTP id y27-v6mr91060qty.2.1540692672789; Sat, 27 Oct 2018 19:11:12 -0700 (PDT) Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!e5-v6no8121468qtr.0!news-out.google.com!c29-v6ni581qtg.1!nntp.google.com!e5-v6no8121462qtr.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help In-Reply-To: Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Original-Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=72.43.228.70; posting-account=xePGxQoAAAAgJalA5zaHmrGIX9Wk_gLW Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 72.43.228.70 Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:224331 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:118460 Archived-At: On Saturday, October 27, 2018 at 9:16:13 PM UTC-4, Jean-Christophe Helary w= rote: >> On Oct 28, 2018, at 9:27, Garreau, Alexandre wrote: >>=20 >> On 2018-10-27 at 09:54, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: >>> Gene, >>>=20 >>> Thank you for this remark. I totally agree with you. elisp should be >>> considered a domain specific language and not be compared to general >>> purpose languages in general. =20 >> emacs lisp *can* and *is* used as a general purpose language. >=20 > If you consider Emacs as a virtual lisp machine, yes.=20 > If you consider Emacs as a text editor, much less so. >=20 > Teaching elisp as strictly a lisp dialect,=20 > removes it from its utility as being Emacs extension language. Isn't this the problem with any/every narrow-scoped portrayal of any and ev= ery would-be `subject' in a given Universe of Discourse? When anything is beheld from only one Point-of-View, one worldview, one pre= judicing lens the necessarily subjective observer learns the prejudicial co= gnitive framework along with the material/subject portrayed as figural ONLY= in the contextual backdrop in which it was contrasted. As a text processor it might behoove one to meditate on the fundamentals of= tickertapes of characters. If one has been biased by other languages supporting `strings' one might pr= oject that bias upon 1D vectors/arrays/strings which can be thought-of-as o= r ALSO-thought-of-as said vectors or arrays ... all of which can be dealt w= ith a `sequences' which elisp supports, but perhaps not common lisp, scheme= , GIMP's script-fu, or AutoCAD's autolisp or visual lisp, etc,=20 And what about `rectangles'? What's up with rectangles of text? One might not encounter them with sed, ed, nano, pico, gedit, or any given = word processor. Which features of elisp lend support to various major modes, programming la= nguage syntaxes, screen scraping, computational linguistics, boilerplate ge= neration, data entry ... whatever is of interest to YOU? Which features of elisp allow it to outsource processing via faster program= ming languages? When would one want to enclose elisp in a ".el" file ... and when might it = be better to include elisp source in an org-mode code block, perhaps along = with source code from those faster, `sucks less', presumably *better* progr= amming languages? How can elisp allow an emacs user to splice-together `code' from several pr= ogramming languages, launch apps and/or processes which generate `text' whi= ch is subsequently inserted in one-or-more buffers? These seem the kinds of questions one might ask oneself pursuant to exploit= ing emacs as both a work shop of interoperable tools AND an artist studio. FWIW