From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: RE: Reserved keymap not reserved anymore? Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2013 16:58:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: References: <1384721854.2758.329.camel@homebase> <01fe8243-3ed0-45a7-9c4e-9c0280f947e1@default> <1384723924.2758.332.camel@homebase> <874n7a6424.fsf@web.de> <1384730310.2758.338.camel@homebase> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1384736348 26531 80.91.229.3 (18 Nov 2013 00:59:08 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2013 00:59:08 +0000 (UTC) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: psmith@gnu.org, Michael Heerdegen Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Nov 18 01:59:13 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ViDBI-0007UO-L0 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 01:59:12 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40780 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ViDBI-0004h2-6K for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 17 Nov 2013 19:59:12 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:54155) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ViDAy-0004Yy-M3 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Nov 2013 19:59:01 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ViDAn-0000RV-LP for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Nov 2013 19:58:52 -0500 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:39044) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ViDAe-0000QY-IS; Sun, 17 Nov 2013 19:58:32 -0500 Original-Received: from acsinet21.oracle.com (acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1) with ESMTP id rAI0wTec004801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 18 Nov 2013 00:58:30 GMT Original-Received: from aserz7022.oracle.com (aserz7022.oracle.com [141.146.126.231]) by acsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id rAI0wSgB028719 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Nov 2013 00:58:29 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0016.oracle.com (abhmp0016.oracle.com [141.146.116.22]) by aserz7022.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id rAI0wSIB011945; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 00:58:28 GMT In-Reply-To: <1384730310.2758.338.camel@homebase> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6680.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-Received-From: 156.151.31.81 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:94529 Archived-At: > > Drew, don't you think it belongs in the user manual? This is not > > a programmer's issue - a user should know which keys he can use > > for his bindings, and which are reserved. Do I miss something? There are NO keys that are reserved for something other than users. It's the opposite. Some keys are reserved _for users_. ALL keys are available to users for their own bindings. (I know that you know this. Just want to be clear.) =20 > I think it belongs in both. In the Emacs manual, as you say, so > users know about it. And in the Elisp manual so people writing new > modes, etc. know about the reservation and don't use it. My $0.02. My opinion doesn't count for much, but since you ask, no, I don't really think the whole rundown of key conventions belongs in the user manual. What belongs in the user manual somewhere is a cross reference to the Elisp manual, and some mention of what I said above: Some key sequences (in particular, `C-c LETTER') are reserved for users, but users are free to bind any keys they like. The reason users might want to be aware of the keys that are NOT reserved for users is that if a user binds such a key it risks conflicting with some binding established by code, typically overriding the latter. But I think the info about the conventions can be kept only in the Elisp manual and pointed to by the user manual. Emacs users includes users who write commands and users who bind commands to keys, of course, in addition to users who do not. But to do either of those things you use Emacs Lisp. The conventions about key bindings are most useful to someone writing code that provides a set of key bindings for, e.g., a mode. The best place for the detailed info about key-binding conventions is (only) in the Elisp manual. Nevertheless, it can save a user some grief over possible conflicts if s?he is aware of the keys that risk a conflict. So a cross reference makes sense. Someone else decided long ago to move the info to the Elisp manual. I have not checked whether there is some info in the Emacs manual that mentions anything about this or, more importantly, cross references the Elisp manual details. If you think that readers of the Emacs manual need a litter more help with this, `M-x report-emacs-bug' is your friend...