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From: Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support>
To: Robert Thorpe <rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com>
Cc: Gregory Heytings <gregory@heytings.org>, help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: Re: not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users
Date: Thu, 11 Feb 2021 17:32:09 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <YCU/6UXjKN3ODUt9@protected.rcdrun.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87y2fv2g5o.fsf@robertthorpeconsulting.com>

* Robert Thorpe <rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com> [2021-02-11 10:55]:
> There is another issue....  I'm not sure that third-party packages will
> use the feature.  I'm also on the Reddit Emacs group.  Several of the
> people there use and develop third-party packages.  It seems to me that
> they often do that because they don't want to contribute to core.  Some
> don't like the core Emacs development team and don't  agree with their
> direction for Emacs.  So, would they use such a prefix key if it were
> offered?  Perhaps not.

In relation to those negative impressions, it would be good to lessen
generalization as then this is presented here to other people on
mailing list and feeling may go down the hill, maybe for no good
reason or justification.

Instead of telling "they don't want to contribute to core" it would be
better to say "one person" or "two persons" or better "two persons
among 12" would not like to contribute to the core and then to tell
reasons why, so to be more specific.

Core developers are IMHO friendly and hard working programmers,
extremely cooperative compared to many other societies of people, and
that statement now draws some imaginary negative image without
presenting any facts to it.

"Some don't like the core Emacs development team" -- so instead of
generalizations like that, it would be good to provide the references
as hyperlinks to those statements, that we understand what are the
actual real world problems as only so the problems can be
solved. 

Did those developers already try to participate in emacs development?
There is no factual information, so generalization like that, so is
better to minimize spreading of uncertainties.

You may invite specific people to tell here on the mailing list if
they have any proposal for improvements.

What I see personally is that developers give 20 times more effort in
discussion and there is effort to comfort various opinions of unknown
and known people on this mailing list, they behave kind. Somebody may
like it or not, but instead of generalization it is better to know
exact references to any factual problems.

Jean



  parent reply	other threads:[~2021-02-11 14:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 239+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <1973673328.2493716.1612740554692.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
2021-02-07 23:29 ` Proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users S Boucher via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-07 23:46   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-08  2:06   ` Howard Melman
2021-02-11  1:37     ` Christopher Miles
2021-02-11 13:52       ` Howard Melman
2021-02-11 16:58         ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-02-12  3:31         ` Christopher Miles
2021-02-08  3:31   ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-08 16:22     ` Francis Belliveau
2021-02-08 21:19       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09  0:52         ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09  1:03           ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09  5:58           ` Marcin Borkowski
2021-02-09 12:19             ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09 13:44               ` Marcus Harnisch
2021-02-09 16:48               ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-09 16:53                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 17:24                   ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09 17:33                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 17:43                       ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09 17:35                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 17:45                       ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09 23:55                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-10  1:50                           ` no job control in this shell (was: Proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users) Skip Montanaro
2021-02-10  5:22                             ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-10 10:49                   ` Proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users Jean Louis
2021-02-09 17:24                 ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-11  0:52           ` Francis Belliveau
2021-02-09  5:55       ` Marcin Borkowski
2021-02-09  6:41       ` not good proposal: " Jean Louis
2021-02-09  7:51         ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-10 10:13           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-10 10:43           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-09  8:07         ` Marcin Borkowski
2021-02-10 10:21           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-09  9:13         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-09  9:31           ` C-z, C-c, job control commands [was: not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users] tomas
2021-02-09 12:22             ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-10 10:36           ` not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users Jean Louis
2021-02-10 12:46             ` Marcin Borkowski
2021-02-10 19:14               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-10 19:31                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-10 19:42                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-10 19:31                 ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-10 19:49                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-10 20:20                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-11  7:54                   ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-11  8:30                     ` Joost Kremers
2021-02-11 13:15                       ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-12 10:14                         ` Joost Kremers
2021-02-12 13:00                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-12 16:48                             ` Joost Kremers
2021-02-12 17:33                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-12  8:10                       ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-12 12:37                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-13  7:37                           ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-13  8:50                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 14:17                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 20:48                             ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-02-13 21:17                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 22:23                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-13 23:38                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-02-14 18:30                                 ` Drew Adams
2021-02-15  4:23                               ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-13 23:47                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-15  4:49                               ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-15 18:28                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-16  7:18                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-16  7:26                                     ` Jean Louis
2021-02-11  8:45                     ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-12  5:42                       ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-12  8:44                         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-12  9:58                           ` Joost Kremers
2021-02-12 12:40                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-12 12:47                           ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-12 19:07                             ` Howard Melman
2021-02-12 20:56                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-12 21:05                                 ` Howard Melman
2021-02-16 12:38                                   ` ken
2021-02-12 21:07                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13  7:54                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13  8:03                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13  9:01                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 14:21                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-12 20:04                             ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-12 20:10                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-02-12 20:51                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-12 20:45                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-12 20:57                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13  8:28                                 ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-13  9:56                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 14:43                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 14:55                                       ` math (was: Re: not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users) Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 15:08                                         ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 15:20                                           ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 15:29                                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 20:32                                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 15:09                                         ` Make Super key work in console - was " Jean Louis
2021-02-13 15:23                                           ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-13 15:33                                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 20:26                                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16 11:55                                                 ` OT: more praise to Tramp - was: Re: Make Super key work in console - was Re: math ken
2021-02-13 23:43                                             ` console key tutorial, revised (was: Re: Make Super key work in console - was Re: math (was: Re: not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users)) Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  5:17                                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  6:21                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  8:05                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  8:37                                                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-14  9:36                                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:43                                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 14:36                                                           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  8:58                                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 10:38                                                       ` Snippet for website inquiries by using one click on the email address Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:56                                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 19:38                                           ` Make Super key work in console Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15 11:10                                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-15 16:36                                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15 18:06                                                 ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-15 18:46                                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  6:53                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-16  7:42                                                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-16 11:03                                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-20 14:32                                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-20 15:26                                                         ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-20 15:46                                                           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-02-20 16:07                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-20 16:16                                                               ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-20 16:38                                                                 ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-21  5:31                                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-21  7:18                                                                     ` Yuri Khan
2021-02-21 12:40                                                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-20 16:49                                                               ` Stefan Monnier
2021-02-20 17:27                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-20 18:13                                                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-02-20 18:19                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-20 21:14                                                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-02-21  3:32                                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-21 20:11                                                                           ` Stefan Monnier
2021-02-21  4:56                                                           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-21  5:06                                                             ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-21  5:42                                                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-21  6:10                                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-22  4:59                                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-24 15:37                                                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-12 20:26                           ` not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users Jean Louis
2021-02-12 21:08                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-13  7:59                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13 12:30                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-13  7:12                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-13  8:37                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13  9:09                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-02-13 10:14                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-13  8:17                           ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-14  0:35                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-14  1:54                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  7:58                                 ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  8:33                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  9:34                                     ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:18                                       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 14:29                                         ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 15:26                                           ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 17:22                                             ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 17:56                                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15  4:12                                           ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-15 18:15                                             ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15 18:24                                               ` tomas
2021-02-16  1:30                                               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  6:05                                               ` Stefan Möding
2021-02-16 21:58                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  7:13                                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-16 22:07                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-20 14:39                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-20 19:14                                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-17  8:55                                               ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-17 23:23                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-18  6:29                                                   ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-20 14:54                                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-20 19:21                                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-21  6:02                                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-21  6:21                                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  8:03                                 ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  8:46                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 10:21                                     ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:27                                       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 10:24                                     ` handling viewport in HTML - was " Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:48                                       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 14:37                                         ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 15:21                                           ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 16:26                                             ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 19:44                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-14 19:50                                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 13:11                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-14 13:16                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14  7:58                               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14  8:43                                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 10:16                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 13:21                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 14:31                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-14 22:13                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-15  0:39                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15  2:23                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-15  6:16                                       ` Who use C-x u or C-/ for undo? Who uses C-z for undo? Jean Louis
2021-02-15 17:59                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  6:52                                           ` Jean Louis
2021-02-15 17:56                                       ` not good proposal: "C-z <letter>" reserved for users Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-15 18:03                                         ` tomas
2021-02-15  6:06                                     ` Jean Louis
2021-02-15 18:31                                       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  7:22                                         ` Jean Louis
2021-02-15  4:18                                   ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-15  5:51                                   ` Jean Louis
2021-02-15 18:20                                     ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-16  6:57                                       ` Jean Louis
2021-02-16 22:02                                         ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 11:28                               ` Philip Kaludercic
2021-02-14 12:55                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-14 13:14                                   ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-14 20:22                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-14 20:49                                       ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-11 14:32                     ` Jean Louis [this message]
2021-02-11 16:58                     ` [External] : " Drew Adams
2021-02-12  7:18                       ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-12 17:51                         ` Drew Adams
2021-02-13  7:46                           ` Robert Thorpe
2021-02-08 10:03   ` Proposal: " Colin Baxter
2021-02-08 20:20     ` Leo Butler
2021-02-09  6:02     ` Marcin Borkowski
2021-02-09 12:23       ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-09 12:41         ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-09 12:56           ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-09 13:04             ` Gregory Heytings
2021-02-10 10:54               ` Jean Louis
2021-02-09 13:05             ` Bastian Beranek
2021-02-09 15:59             ` Skip Montanaro
2021-02-09 16:11               ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 16:19                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 20:14               ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-02-09 20:50                 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
2021-02-09 20:18               ` Joost Kremers
2021-02-10 10:57               ` Jean Louis

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