From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jean Louis Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Debunking Emacs merits over GUI - Re: package for Email Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2023 17:28:21 +0300 Message-ID: References: <20230118180348.gzwvy6iztok45ko3@zoho.com> <20230119161030.vt4muwcdvuwdqmj7@zoho.com> <877cxgrc3e.mmmtqrm@thhcbmmmd.mijofcrcc.org> <83a62cmjyi.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7521"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.9+54 (af2080d) (2022-11-21) Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 21 15:29:33 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pJEs9-0001ky-52 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 15:29:33 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJErg-0000bO-4B; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 09:29:04 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJErf-0000bC-3D for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 09:29:03 -0500 Original-Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJErd-0003jz-CN; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 09:29:02 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([::ffff:197.239.14.92]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 0000000000103952.0000000063CBF6AE.0000520E; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 07:29:01 -0700 Mail-Followup-To: Eli Zaretskii , help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <83a62cmjyi.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.170.207.13; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=stw1.rcdrun.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:142473 Archived-At: * Eli Zaretskii [2023-01-21 10:22]: > > Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2023 10:05:31 +0300 > > From: Jean Louis > > Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org > > > > I wanted to say that objectively when somebody is looking for e-mail > > client, it is not good to recommend Emacs in first place. > > Forgive me my bluntness, but that's baloney! Emacs-based email > clients are very adequate, and some of them much more than just > adequate. I'm surprised to even see this in an Emacs forum, let alone > coming from such a veteran Emacs user. > > I challenge you to post a list of tasks people do with email clients > that Emacs-based MUA don't support. OK I understand that you love Emacs, as you are the one making it. I also love some girls, but I can't recommend them to others. What is mine and lovable is not necessary so for other people. I handle bunch of tasks with rudimentary email functions, the technical challenge is not what ordinary people are interested in. What matters is usability. Do you know that less and less people use e-mail? This is because of proprietary WhatsApp and other applications that makes it clear to user that communication may be straightforward. People tend to use what is straightforward. If person is in other room, chances to write e-mail to that person are very low, yelling over or going to talk in that that other room is more probable. It is because people want to communicate straightforward. List of tasks people do with email clients that Emacs-based MUA don't support: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Let us compare it from Thunderbid: Thunderbird Features — Thunderbird: https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/features/ 1. Mail Account Setup Wizard (IMHO all accounts should be specified straight in main configuration, but programs in packages each ask for program specific settings) 2. One-click Address Book (most important lack of feature in Emacs, huge subject) 3. Attachment Reminder 4. Notifications of e-mails 5. Quick Filter 6. Search tools (indexing is there in Emacs, but is different concept) this refers to straight search without user thinking about indexing) 7. Robust privacy (this is included in Emacs only concidentally and due to lack of features) 8. Phishing Protection 9. Automated Update (yes, why should user bother about it?) 10. Cutting Out the Junk 11. Sharing of mail folders 12. Searching messages on IMAP server 13. Synchronization of folders (Emacs uses only external and difficult to setup command line tools, this is huge subject) 14. Automated deletion of IMAP message by user's policy 15. Selection of IMAP folders to be searched or not (IMAP offers fast search) 16. Integrated encrypted XMPP chat (jabber.el does not support OMEMO yet, I offer US $100 for that.) 17. Integrated calendar (M-x calendar is not integrated to e-mail) 18. Move/copy of e-mails from folder to other folder by using mouse 19. Convert e-mail to event 20. Convert e-mail to task 21. Drag and drop of attachments 22. HTML based e-mail writing 23. Attachment of WWW hyperlinks 24. Publish integrated calendar events/tasks 25. Automatic collection of e-mail addresses -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/