finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
there some really good method or log file or something else which would
help finding where the hork point is?

tia

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Yuan Fu]

> On Aug 26, 2020, at 4:08 PM, ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:
> 
> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
> help finding where the hork point is?
> 
> tia
> 
> 

You can start Emacs with --debug-init and Emacs will stop at the error point.

Yuan

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Stefan Kangas]

ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:

> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
> help finding where the hork point is?

Try using:

emacs --debug-init

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/26/20 4:12 PM, Stefan Kangas wrote:
> ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:
>
>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
>> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
>> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
>> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
>> help finding where the hork point is?
> Try using:
>
> emacs --debug-init
Thanks much, Yuan and Stefan.

Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do I look at...?  What
file or buffer...? or output?  I don't see anything at all diagnostic.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

ken wrote:

> Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do
> I look at...?  What file or buffer...? or output? 
> I don't see anything at all diagnostic.

First step is to identify what exact piece of code
that is causing the problem.

Run $ emacs -Q # that works fine

Run Emacs with your init. Oups, problem!

Insight: The problem is between those two endpoints.
Squeeze them together until you find it.

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/26/20 7:27 PM, Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text
editor wrote:
> ken wrote:
>
>> Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do
>> I look at...?  What file or buffer...? or output? 
>> I don't see anything at all diagnostic.
> First step is to identify what exact piece of code
> that is causing the problem.
>
> Run $ emacs -Q # that works fine
>
> Run Emacs with your init. Oups, problem!
>
> Insight: The problem is between those two endpoints.
> Squeeze them together until you find it.
>
Emacs starts and runs fine.  I already know the problem is in my .emacs.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

ken wrote:

> Emacs starts and runs fine.  I already know the
> problem is in my .emacs.

But where?

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2020 18:38:19 -0400
> 
> On 8/26/20 4:12 PM, Stefan Kangas wrote:
> > ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:
> >
> >> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
> >> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
> >> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
> >> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
> >> help finding where the hork point is?
> > Try using:
> >
> > emacs --debug-init
> Thanks much, Yuan and Stefan.
> 
> Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do I look at...?  What
> file or buffer...? or output?  I don't see anything at all diagnostic.

If Emacs starts normally with --debug-init, then the problem is not
that something in your init file errors out.

So you need to tell more about the problems you see: what exactly
leads you to believe that something in the init file is not working?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/27/20 12:08 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2020 18:38:19 -0400
>>
>> On 8/26/20 4:12 PM, Stefan Kangas wrote:
>>> ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:
>>>
>>>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
>>>> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
>>>> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
>>>> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
>>>> help finding where the hork point is?
>>> Try using:
>>>
>>> emacs --debug-init
>> Thanks much, Yuan and Stefan.
>>
>> Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do I look at...?  What
>> file or buffer...? or output?  I don't see anything at all diagnostic.
> If Emacs starts normally with --debug-init, then the problem is not
> that something in your init file errors out.
>
> So you need to tell more about the problems you see: what exactly
> leads you to believe that something in the init file is not working?
>

Good question.  There is an "add-on", an additional mode which my .emacs
gets started, but it doesn't get started.  My understanding is that the
error would be before that code, yes?

(I just ran through and tested that entire body of code, and found no
error at all.)

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2020 13:24:51 -0400
> 
> > So you need to tell more about the problems you see: what exactly
> > leads you to believe that something in the init file is not working?
> >
> 
> Good question.  There is an "add-on", an additional mode which my .emacs
> gets started, but it doesn't get started.  My understanding is that the
> error would be before that code, yes?

It could be before, or it could be in that mode.

What additional mode is that?  How do you turn it on?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/27/20 1:42 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2020 13:24:51 -0400
>>
>>> So you need to tell more about the problems you see: what exactly
>>> leads you to believe that something in the init file is not working?
>>>
>> Good question.  There is an "add-on", an additional mode which my .emacs
>> gets started, but it doesn't get started.  My understanding is that the
>> error would be before that code, yes?
> It could be before, or it could be in that mode.

OKay, I suspected that, wasn't sure.  Makes sense.  Best to hear it from
an expert.

>
> What additional mode is that?  How do you turn it on?

It's a super-old package, still in quite a bit of use, called
html-helper-mode.  I've come to love it a lot, way more than emacs'
native html editor.  I've customized it quite a bit over the years
also.  Today I went through the whole thing (over 2600 lines for your
carpal tunnel pleasure) and tested every function and definition etc.,
and everything worked.  And when I got to the last line, it was loaded,
So I opened a test.html file, used it in all kinds of ways, and
everything worked fine.  So I'm fairly certain that it's some other code
before that's invoked which is bringing about the error.

It's turned on with this in my ~/.emacs:

(autoload 'html-helper-mode "html-helper-mode" "Yay HTML" t)

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2020 18:40:54 -0400
> 
> > What additional mode is that?  How do you turn it on?
> 
> It's a super-old package, still in quite a bit of use, called
> html-helper-mode.  I've come to love it a lot, way more than emacs'
> native html editor.  I've customized it quite a bit over the years
> also.  Today I went through the whole thing (over 2600 lines for your
> carpal tunnel pleasure) and tested every function and definition etc.,
> and everything worked.  And when I got to the last line, it was loaded,
> So I opened a test.html file, used it in all kinds of ways, and
> everything worked fine.  So I'm fairly certain that it's some other code
> before that's invoked which is bringing about the error.
> 
> It's turned on with this in my ~/.emacs:
> 
> (autoload 'html-helper-mode "html-helper-mode" "Yay HTML" t)

So if you start Emacs without that line, and then evaluate that line
via "M-:", everything works as expected with that mode?  But if that
line is present in your .emacs, something doesn't work well, is that
right?  If so, what exactly doesn't work in the latter case?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/28/20 2:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2020 18:40:54 -0400
>>
>>> What additional mode is that?  How do you turn it on?
>> It's a super-old package, still in quite a bit of use, called
>> html-helper-mode.  I've come to love it a lot, way more than emacs'
>> native html editor.  I've customized it quite a bit over the years
>> also.  Today I went through the whole thing (over 2600 lines for your
>> carpal tunnel pleasure) and tested every function and definition etc.,
>> and everything worked.  And when I got to the last line, it was loaded,
>> So I opened a test.html file, used it in all kinds of ways, and
>> everything worked fine.  So I'm fairly certain that it's some other code
>> before that's invoked which is bringing about the error.
>>
>> It's turned on with this in my ~/.emacs:
>>
>> (autoload 'html-helper-mode "html-helper-mode" "Yay HTML" t)
> So if you start Emacs without that line, and then evaluate that line
> via "M-:", everything works as expected with that mode?  But if that
> line is present in your .emacs, something doesn't work well, is that
> right?  If so, what exactly doesn't work in the latter case?
>

Thanks for your continuing interest in my problem(s).  Answering your
question in another way (I believe), yesterday when html-helper-mode
wasn't operative at all, as if it wasn't loaded at all, I went into the
html-helper-mode.el file and evaluated (executed with C-x C-e at the end
of every defun and defvar etc.), none of them errored out and
html-helper-mode worked, and AFAICT worked completely.  That would seem
to eliminate it as the source of the problem, yes?

Moreover, and quite strangely, since then every time I've restarted
emacs, html-helper-mode has loaded and worked fine.  And, no, of course
I haven't made any changes to either html-helper-mode.el or to .emacs
(well, nothing at all substantive or relevant).  So that problem seems
to have magically disappeared.

However, now I'm having a very strange problem with tramp, one unrelated
to html of any kind.  I'll describe that in a separate post.  But it's
very strange how the problem seems to be bouncing around, appearing in
different parts of my unchanged code.  Is that even conceivable?  I
would think that I have a problem with some bad RAM, but emacs is the
only thing I'm having problems with, having no problem in any other
software on my system (nothing I've perceived, anyway).

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[ken]

On 8/26/20 6:38 PM, ken wrote:
> On 8/26/20 4:12 PM, Stefan Kangas wrote:
>> ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:
>>
>>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully working.  A
>>> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
>>> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade).  Is
>>> there some really good method or log file or something else which would
>>> help finding where the hork point is?
>> Try using:
>>
>> emacs --debug-init
> Thanks much, Yuan and Stefan.
>
> Okay, I ran that.  Emacs comes up.  Then what do I look at...?  What
> file or buffer...? or output?  I don't see anything at all diagnostic.

Uncle Web gave me an answer: it's a buffer emacs calls *Messages*. 

The first errors in it:

Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
Loading minibuffer...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading minibuffer...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading frame...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading frame...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading startup...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading startup...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading term/tty-colors...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading term/tty-colors...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-core...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-core...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading facemenu...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading facemenu...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-lock...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-lock...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading jit-lock...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading jit-lock...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading mouse...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading mouse...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading scroll-bar...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading scroll-bar...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading select...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading select...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...done
Loading isearch...done

There's no such text in any of my code, no "timerp" or "timer".  I have
no idea where to look for the source of these errors. 

Anyone know about this?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[Noam Postavsky]

On Thu, 27 Aug 2020 at 13:17, ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:

> Uncle Web gave me an answer: it's a buffer emacs calls *Messages*.
>
> The first errors in it:

The "Loading" lines look suspicious. Shouldn't all those be preloaded?
Maybe Emacs is failing to find the .pdmp file? Do you get these
"Loading" messages when starting with emacs -Q too?

> Loading minibuffer...
> Loading frame...
> Loading startup...
> Loading term/tty-colors...
> Loading font-core...
> Loading facemenu...
> Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
> Loading font-lock...
> Loading jit-lock...
> Loading mouse...
> Loading scroll-bar...
> Loading select...

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[ken]

On 8/27/20 1:34 PM, Noam Postavsky wrote:
> The "Loading" lines look suspicious. Shouldn't all those be preloaded?
> Maybe Emacs is failing to find the .pdmp file? Do you get these
> "Loading" messages when starting with emacs -Q too?
>
>> Loading minibuffer...
>> Loading frame...
>> Loading startup...
>> Loading term/tty-colors...
>> Loading font-core...
>> Loading facemenu...
>> Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
>> Loading font-lock...
>> Loading jit-lock...
>> Loading mouse...
>> Loading scroll-bar...
>> Loading select...

Output in terminal from "emacs -Q" :

Warning: game dir '/var/games/emacs': Permission denied
Loading loadup.el (source)...
dump mode: nil
Using load-path (/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/emacs-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/progmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/language
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/textmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/vc)
Loading emacs-lisp/byte-run...
Loading emacs-lisp/byte-run...done
Loading emacs-lisp/backquote...
Loading emacs-lisp/backquote...done
Loading subr...
Loading subr...done
Loading version...
Loading version...done
Loading widget...
Loading widget...done
Loading custom...
Loading custom...done
Loading emacs-lisp/map-ynp...
Loading emacs-lisp/map-ynp...done
Loading international/mule...
Loading international/mule...done
Loading international/mule-conf...
Loading international/mule-conf...done
Loading env...
Loading env...done
Loading format...
Loading format...done
Loading bindings (source)...
Loading bindings (source)...done
Loading window...
Loading window...done
Loading files...
Loading files...done
Loading emacs-lisp/macroexp...
Loading emacs-lisp/macroexp...done
Loading cus-face...
Loading cus-face...done
Loading faces...
Loading faces...done
Loading button...
Loading button...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/loaddefs.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/loaddefs.el (source)...done
Loading emacs-lisp/nadvice...
Loading emacs-lisp/nadvice...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-preloaded...
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-preloaded...done
Loading obarray...
Loading obarray...done
Loading abbrev...
Loading abbrev...done
Loading simple...
Loading simple...done
Loading help...
Loading help...done
Loading jka-cmpr-hook...
Loading jka-cmpr-hook...done
Loading epa-hook...
Loading epa-hook...done
Loading international/mule-cmds...
Loading international/mule-cmds...done
Loading case-table...
Loading case-table...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international/charprop.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international/charprop.el (source)...done
Loading international/characters...
Loading international/characters...done
Loading composite...
Loading composite...done
Loading language/chinese...
Loading language/chinese...done
Loading language/cyrillic...
Loading language/cyrillic...done
Loading language/indian...
Loading language/indian...done
Loading language/sinhala...
Loading language/sinhala...done
Loading language/english...
Loading language/english...done
Loading language/ethiopic...
Loading language/ethiopic...done
Loading language/european...
Loading language/european...done
Loading language/czech...
Loading language/czech...done
Loading language/slovak...
Loading language/slovak...done
Loading language/romanian...
Loading language/romanian...done
Loading language/greek...
Loading language/greek...done
Loading language/hebrew...
Loading language/hebrew...done
Loading international/cp51932...
Loading international/cp51932...done
Loading international/eucjp-ms...
Loading international/eucjp-ms...done
Loading language/japanese...
Loading language/japanese...done
Loading language/korean...
Loading language/korean...done
Loading language/lao...
Loading language/lao...done
Loading language/tai-viet...
Loading language/tai-viet...done
Loading language/thai...
Loading language/thai...done
Loading language/tibetan...
Loading language/tibetan...done
Loading language/vietnamese...
Loading language/vietnamese...done
Loading language/misc-lang...
Loading language/misc-lang...done
Loading language/utf-8-lang...
Loading language/utf-8-lang...done
Loading language/georgian...
Loading language/georgian...done
Loading language/khmer...
Loading language/khmer...done
Loading language/burmese...
Loading language/burmese...done
Loading language/cham...
Loading language/cham...done
Loading indent...
Loading indent...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
Loading minibuffer...
Loading minibuffer...done
Loading frame...
Loading frame...done
Loading startup...
Loading startup...done
Loading term/tty-colors...
Loading term/tty-colors...done
Loading font-core...
Loading font-core...done
Loading facemenu...
Loading facemenu...done
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...done
Loading font-lock...
Loading font-lock...done
Loading jit-lock...
Loading jit-lock...done
Loading mouse...
Loading mouse...done
Loading scroll-bar...
Loading scroll-bar...done
Loading select...
Loading select...done
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...done
Loading isearch...
Loading isearch...done
Loading rfn-eshadow...
Loading rfn-eshadow...done
Loading menu-bar...
Loading menu-bar...done
Loading tab-bar...
Loading tab-bar...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp...
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp...done
Loading textmodes/page...
Loading textmodes/page...done
Loading register...
Loading register...done
Loading textmodes/paragraphs...
Loading textmodes/paragraphs...done
Loading progmodes/prog-mode...
Loading progmodes/prog-mode...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp-mode...
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp-mode...done
Loading progmodes/elisp-mode...
Loading progmodes/elisp-mode...done
Loading textmodes/text-mode...
Loading textmodes/text-mode...done
Loading textmodes/fill...
Loading textmodes/fill...done
Loading newcomment...
Loading newcomment...done
Loading replace...
Loading replace...done
Loading emacs-lisp/tabulated-list...
Loading emacs-lisp/tabulated-list...done
Loading buff-menu...
Loading buff-menu...done
Loading fringe...
Loading fringe...done
Loading emacs-lisp/regexp-opt...
Loading emacs-lisp/regexp-opt...done
Loading image...
Loading image...done
Loading international/fontset...
Loading international/fontset...done
Loading dnd...
Loading dnd...done
Loading tool-bar...
Loading tool-bar...done
Loading dynamic-setting...
Loading dynamic-setting...done
Loading x-dnd...
Loading x-dnd...done
Loading term/common-win...
Loading term/common-win...done
Loading term/x-win...
Loading term/x-win...done
Loading mwheel...
Loading mwheel...done
Loading emacs-lisp/float-sup...
Loading emacs-lisp/float-sup...done
Loading vc/vc-hooks...
Loading vc/vc-hooks...done
Loading vc/ediff-hook...
Loading vc/ediff-hook...done
Loading uniquify...
Loading uniquify...done
Loading electric...
Loading electric...done
Loading emacs-lisp/eldoc...
Loading emacs-lisp/eldoc...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/cus-start.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/cus-start.el (source)...done
Loading tooltip...
Loading tooltip...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/leim/leim-list.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/leim/leim-list.el (source)...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...
Loading lpr...
Loading lpr...done
Loading delsel...
Loading delsel...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...done
Finding pointers to doc strings...
Finding pointers to doc strings...done


 
Output in terminal from "emacs --debug-init" :

Warning: game dir '/var/games/emacs': Permission denied
Loading loadup.el (source)...
dump mode: nil
Using load-path (/usr/share/emacs/27.1/site-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/emacs-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/progmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/language
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/textmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/vc)
Loading emacs-lisp/byte-run...
Loading emacs-lisp/byte-run...done
Loading emacs-lisp/backquote...
Loading emacs-lisp/backquote...done
Loading subr...
Loading subr...done
Loading version...
Loading version...done
Loading widget...
Loading widget...done
Loading custom...
Loading custom...done
Loading emacs-lisp/map-ynp...
Loading emacs-lisp/map-ynp...done
Loading international/mule...
Loading international/mule...done
Loading international/mule-conf...
Loading international/mule-conf...done
Loading env...
Loading env...done
Loading format...
Loading format...done
Loading bindings (source)...
Loading bindings (source)...done
Loading window...
Loading window...done
Loading files...
Loading files...done
Loading emacs-lisp/macroexp...
Loading emacs-lisp/macroexp...done
Loading cus-face...
Loading cus-face...done
Loading faces...
Loading faces...done
Loading button...
Loading button...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/loaddefs.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/loaddefs.el (source)...done
Loading emacs-lisp/nadvice...
Loading emacs-lisp/nadvice...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-preloaded...
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-preloaded...done
Loading obarray...
Loading obarray...done
Loading abbrev...
Loading abbrev...done
Loading simple...
Loading simple...done
Loading help...
Loading help...done
Loading jka-cmpr-hook...
Loading jka-cmpr-hook...done
Loading epa-hook...
Loading epa-hook...done
Loading international/mule-cmds...
Loading international/mule-cmds...done
Loading case-table...
Loading case-table...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international/charprop.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international/charprop.el (source)...done
Loading international/characters...
Loading international/characters...done
Loading composite...
Loading composite...done
Loading language/chinese...
Loading language/chinese...done
Loading language/cyrillic...
Loading language/cyrillic...done
Loading language/indian...
Loading language/indian...done
Loading language/sinhala...
Loading language/sinhala...done
Loading language/english...
Loading language/english...done
Loading language/ethiopic...
Loading language/ethiopic...done
Loading language/european...
Loading language/european...done
Loading language/czech...
Loading language/czech...done
Loading language/slovak...
Loading language/slovak...done
Loading language/romanian...
Loading language/romanian...done
Loading language/greek...
Loading language/greek...done
Loading language/hebrew...
Loading language/hebrew...done
Loading international/cp51932...
Loading international/cp51932...done
Loading international/eucjp-ms...
Loading international/eucjp-ms...done
Loading language/japanese...
Loading language/japanese...done
Loading language/korean...
Loading language/korean...done
Loading language/lao...
Loading language/lao...done
Loading language/tai-viet...
Loading language/tai-viet...done
Loading language/thai...
Loading language/thai...done
Loading language/tibetan...
Loading language/tibetan...done
Loading language/vietnamese...
Loading language/vietnamese...done
Loading language/misc-lang...
Loading language/misc-lang...done
Loading language/utf-8-lang...
Loading language/utf-8-lang...done
Loading language/georgian...
Loading language/georgian...done
Loading language/khmer...
Loading language/khmer...done
Loading language/burmese...
Loading language/burmese...done
Loading language/cham...
Loading language/cham...done
Loading indent...
Loading indent...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
Loading minibuffer...
Loading minibuffer...done
Loading frame...
Loading frame...done
Loading startup...
Loading startup...done
Loading term/tty-colors...
Loading term/tty-colors...done
Loading font-core...
Loading font-core...done
Loading facemenu...
Loading facemenu...done
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...done
Loading font-lock...
Loading font-lock...done
Loading jit-lock...
Loading jit-lock...done
Loading mouse...
Loading mouse...done
Loading scroll-bar...
Loading scroll-bar...done
Loading select...
Loading select...done
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...done
Loading isearch...
Loading isearch...done
Loading rfn-eshadow...
Loading rfn-eshadow...done
Loading menu-bar...
Loading menu-bar...done
Loading tab-bar...
Loading tab-bar...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp...
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp...done
Loading textmodes/page...
Loading textmodes/page...done
Loading register...
Loading register...done
Loading textmodes/paragraphs...
Loading textmodes/paragraphs...done
Loading progmodes/prog-mode...
Loading progmodes/prog-mode...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp-mode...
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp-mode...done
Loading progmodes/elisp-mode...
Loading progmodes/elisp-mode...done
Loading textmodes/text-mode...
Loading textmodes/text-mode...done
Loading textmodes/fill...
Loading textmodes/fill...done
Loading newcomment...
Loading newcomment...done
Loading replace...
Loading replace...done
Loading emacs-lisp/tabulated-list...
Loading emacs-lisp/tabulated-list...done
Loading buff-menu...
Loading buff-menu...done
Loading fringe...
Loading fringe...done
Loading emacs-lisp/regexp-opt...
Loading emacs-lisp/regexp-opt...done
Loading image...
Loading image...done
Loading international/fontset...
Loading international/fontset...done
Loading dnd...
Loading dnd...done
Loading tool-bar...
Loading tool-bar...done
Loading dynamic-setting...
Loading dynamic-setting...done
Loading x-dnd...
Loading x-dnd...done
Loading term/common-win...
Loading term/common-win...done
Loading term/x-win...
Loading term/x-win...done
Loading mwheel...
Loading mwheel...done
Loading emacs-lisp/float-sup...
Loading emacs-lisp/float-sup...done
Loading vc/vc-hooks...
Loading vc/vc-hooks...done
Loading vc/ediff-hook...
Loading vc/ediff-hook...done
Loading uniquify...
Loading uniquify...done
Loading electric...
Loading electric...done
Loading emacs-lisp/eldoc...
Loading emacs-lisp/eldoc...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/cus-start.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/cus-start.el (source)...done
Loading tooltip...
Loading tooltip...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/leim/leim-list.el (source)...
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/leim/leim-list.el (source)...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...
Loading lpr...
Loading lpr...done
Loading delsel...
Loading delsel...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...done
Finding pointers to doc strings...
Finding pointers to doc strings...done

To make our busy days easier, I put both outputs in separate files and
did a diff on them:

$ diff emacs--debug.out ems-Q.out
4c4
< Using load-path (/usr/share/emacs/27.1/site-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/emacs-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/progmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/language
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/textmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/vc)
---
> Using load-path (/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/emacs-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/progmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/language
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/textmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/vc)
235d234
<

The only difference I see in these two loadpaths is the first two
directories of the debug-init output (for site-lisp) aren't in the -Q
output.

For completeness sake, here's the contents of the *Messages* buffer:

Loading loadup.el (source)...
dump mode: nil
Using load-path (/usr/share/emacs/27.1/site-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/emacs-lisp
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/progmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/language
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international
/usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/textmodes /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/vc)
Loading emacs-lisp/byte-run...done
Loading emacs-lisp/backquote...done
Loading subr...done
Loading version...done
Loading widget...done
Loading custom...done
Loading emacs-lisp/map-ynp...done
Loading international/mule...done
Loading international/mule-conf...done
Loading env...done
Loading format...done
Loading bindings (source)...done
Loading window...done
Loading files...done
Loading emacs-lisp/macroexp...done
Loading cus-face...done
Loading faces...done
Loading button...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/loaddefs.el (source)...done
Loading emacs-lisp/nadvice...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-preloaded...done
Loading obarray...done
Loading abbrev...done
Loading simple...done
Loading help...done
Loading jka-cmpr-hook...done
Loading epa-hook...done
Loading international/mule-cmds...done
Loading case-table...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/international/charprop.el (source)...done
Loading international/characters...done
Loading composite...done
Loading language/chinese...done
Loading language/cyrillic...done
Loading language/indian...done
Loading language/sinhala...done
Loading language/english...done
Loading language/ethiopic...done
Loading language/european...done
Loading language/czech...done
Loading language/slovak...done
Loading language/romanian...done
Loading language/greek...done
Loading language/hebrew...done
Loading international/cp51932...done
Loading international/eucjp-ms...done
Loading language/japanese...done
Loading language/korean...done
Loading language/lao...done
Loading language/tai-viet...done
Loading language/thai...done
Loading language/tibetan...done
Loading language/vietnamese...done
Loading language/misc-lang...done
Loading language/utf-8-lang...done
Loading language/georgian...done
Loading language/khmer...done
Loading language/burmese...done
Loading language/cham...done
Loading indent...done
Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
Loading minibuffer...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading minibuffer...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading frame...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading frame...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading startup...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading startup...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading term/tty-colors...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading term/tty-colors...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-core...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-core...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading facemenu...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading facemenu...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/syntax...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-lock...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading font-lock...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading jit-lock...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading jit-lock...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading mouse...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading mouse...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading scroll-bar...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading scroll-bar...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading select...
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading select...done
Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
(void-function timerp)
Loading emacs-lisp/timer...done
Loading isearch...done
Loading rfn-eshadow...done
Loading menu-bar...done
Loading tab-bar...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp...done
Loading textmodes/page...done
Loading register...done
Loading textmodes/paragraphs...done
Loading progmodes/prog-mode...done
Loading emacs-lisp/lisp-mode...done
Loading progmodes/elisp-mode...done
Loading textmodes/text-mode...done
Loading textmodes/fill...done
Loading newcomment...done
Loading replace...done
Loading emacs-lisp/tabulated-list...done
Loading buff-menu...done
Loading fringe...done
Loading emacs-lisp/regexp-opt...done
Loading image...done
Loading international/fontset...done
Loading dnd...done
Loading tool-bar...done
Loading dynamic-setting...done
Loading x-dnd...done
Loading term/common-win...done
Loading term/x-win...done
Loading mwheel...done
Loading emacs-lisp/float-sup...done
Loading vc/vc-hooks...done
Loading vc/ediff-hook...done
Loading uniquify...done
Loading electric...done
Loading emacs-lisp/eldoc...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/cus-start.el (source)...done
Loading tooltip...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/leim/leim-list.el (source)...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...
Loading lpr...done
Loading delsel...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/site-load.el (source)...done
Finding pointers to doc strings...done
Loading desktop...done
Loading saveplace...done
Loading /home/aaa/.abbrevs...done
Loading /home/aaa/emacs.d/menus.el (source)...done
Loading /home/aaa/emacs.d/journal.el (source)...done
Loading /home/aaa/emacs.d/kenz.el (source)...done
Desktop: File "/home/aaa/test" no longer exists.
Tramp: Opening connection for remote using scp...

[.... Tramp successfully loads some files into buffers....]

Wrote /home/aaa/.emacs.d/.emacs.desktop.lock
Desktop: 13 frames, 63 buffers restored, 1 failed to restore.
For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
Loading loadup.el (source)...done
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1012) signaled (void-variable
bufname)

[End of *Messages* buffer]

I just noticed that html-helper-mode seems to be working fine now, but
tramp is having a strange problem.  (More on the latter later....)

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 06:07:19 -0400
> 
> Output in terminal from "emacs -Q" :
> 
> Warning: game dir '/var/games/emacs': Permission denied
> Loading loadup.el (source)...
> dump mode: nil
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This indicates that Emacs cannot find the emacs.pdmp file.  You should
fix this problem before you continue investigating any further
problems, because when Emacs doesn't find its dump file, all kinds of
weird problems can happen.  So everything you said until now is more
or less unimportant, until you resolve the problem with the emacs.pdmp
file.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[ken]

On 8/28/20 7:13 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 06:07:19 -0400
>>
>> Output in terminal from "emacs -Q" :
>>
>> Warning: game dir '/var/games/emacs': Permission denied
>> Loading loadup.el (source)...
>> dump mode: nil
>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> This indicates that Emacs cannot find the emacs.pdmp file.  You should
> fix this problem before you continue investigating any further
> problems, because when Emacs doesn't find its dump file, all kinds of
> weird problems can happen.  So everything you said until now is more
> or less unimportant, until you resolve the problem with the emacs.pdmp
> file.

Thanks, but I know nothing at all about this file, never heard of it. 
Looking for it:

"locate emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.

"rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.

So it appears I don't have it and never did.

Are these permissions etc. correct?

# ls -ld /var/games/emacs
drwxrwx--- 1 games games 50 Aug 16 15:50 /var/games/emacs

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 08:08:43 -0400
> 
> >> Loading loadup.el (source)...
> >> dump mode: nil
> >   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > This indicates that Emacs cannot find the emacs.pdmp file.  You should
> > fix this problem before you continue investigating any further
> > problems, because when Emacs doesn't find its dump file, all kinds of
> > weird problems can happen.  So everything you said until now is more
> > or less unimportant, until you resolve the problem with the emacs.pdmp
> > file.
> 
> Thanks, but I know nothing at all about this file, never heard of it. 
> Looking for it:
> 
> "locate emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
> 
> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
> 
> So it appears I don't have it and never did.

Very strange.  Once Emacs starts, if you type

  M-x report-emacs-bug RET

what do you see in the buffer that Emacs pops?  Please post all of its
contents.

> Are these permissions etc. correct?
> 
> # ls -ld /var/games/emacs
> drwxrwx--- 1 games games 50 Aug 16 15:50 /var/games/emacs

maybe, but the problem with this directory doesn't seem to be related
to your main problems.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[ken]

On 8/28/20 8:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 08:08:43 -0400
>>
>>>> Loading loadup.el (source)...
>>>> dump mode: nil
>>>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>> This indicates that Emacs cannot find the emacs.pdmp file.  You should
>>> fix this problem before you continue investigating any further
>>> problems, because when Emacs doesn't find its dump file, all kinds of
>>> weird problems can happen.  So everything you said until now is more
>>> or less unimportant, until you resolve the problem with the emacs.pdmp
>>> file.
>> Thanks, but I know nothing at all about this file, never heard of it. 
>> Looking for it:
>>
>> "locate emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>
>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>
>> So it appears I don't have it and never did.
> Very strange.  Once Emacs starts, if you type
>
>   M-x report-emacs-bug RET
>
> what do you see in the buffer that Emacs pops?  Please post all of its
> contents.

To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: 27.1; pdmp
--text follows this line--




In GNU Emacs 27.1 (build 1, x86_64-suse-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.22,
cairo version 1.16.0)
 of 2020-08-28 built on nv
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12008000
System Description: openSUSE Tumbleweed

Recent messages:
Loading /home/aaa/.emacs...done
Mark saved where search started
End of buffer
Mark saved where search started [2 times]
Mark set [2 times]
Quit
Mark saved where search started
Mark set [3 times]
Saving file /home/aaa/.emacs...
Wrote /home/aaa/.emacs


Configured features:
XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG CAIRO SOUND DBUS GSETTINGS GLIB NOTIFY
INOTIFY ACL LIBSELINUX GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF
ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 XDBE XIM MODULES THREADS XWIDGETS
LIBSYSTEMD JSON PDUMPER LCMS2 GMP

Important settings:
  value of $LC_CTYPE: en_US.UTF-8
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: POSIX
  value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
  value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=ibus
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Emacs-Lisp

Minor modes in effect:
  TeX-PDF-mode: t
  shell-dirtrack-mode: t
  save-place-mode: t
  desktop-save-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  global-eldoc-mode: t
  eldoc-mode: t
  electric-indent-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  column-number-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  abbrev-mode: t

Load-path shadows:
~/emacs.d/url hides /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/url/url
~/emacs.d/url-dav hides /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/url/url-dav
~/emacs.d/smtpmail hides /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/mail/smtpmail
~/emacs.d/cal-china hides /usr/share/emacs/27.1/lisp/calendar/cal-china

Features:
(shadow sort mail-extr warnings emacsbug message rmc dired
dired-loaddefs rfc822 mml mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail
misearch multi-isearch help-fns radix-tree cl-print debug backtrace
find-func time-stamp font-latex tex dbus crm cl-extra help-mode
sh-script executable image-mode exif mule-util info noutline outline
easy-mmode tramp-cache tramp-sh tramp tramp-loaddefs trampver
tramp-integration files-x tramp-compat shell pcomplete comint ansi-color
ring parse-time iso8601 ls-lisp mhtml-mode css-mode smie eww mm-url gnus
nnheader wid-edit thingatpt url-queue url url-proxy url-privacy
url-expand url-methods url-history mm-view mml-smime mml-sec epa derived
epg epg-config gnus-util rmail rmail-loaddefs mail-utils smime dig
mailcap mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045
mm-util ietf-drums mail-prsvr shr text-property-search url-cookie
url-domsuf url-util url-parse auth-source cl-seq eieio eieio-core
cl-macs eieio-loaddefs password-cache url-vars puny svg xml browse-url
format-spec color js json map imenu html-mode jsp-html-helper-mode
asp-html-helper-mode php-html-helper-mode html-helper-mode advice tempo
cl cc-mode cc-fonts easymenu cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles
cc-align cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs time-date subr-x edmacro kmacro
sgml-mode seq byte-opt gv bytecomp byte-compile cconv dom jka-compr
saveplace desktop frameset cl-loaddefs cl-lib xfonts rmailgen paren
preview-latex auto-loads tex-site ispell delsel cus-load lpr tooltip
cus-start pcase eldoc electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks
lisp-float-type mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd tool-bar
dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment
text-mode elisp-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar
rfn-eshadow isearch timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock
syntax facemenu font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer cl-generic
cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao
korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech
european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite charscript charprop
case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev obarray
cl-preloaded nadvice loaddefs button faces cus-face macroexp files
text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule
custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind
inotify lcms2 dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting
xwidget-internal cairo move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty
make-network-process emacs)

Memory information:
((conses 16 2528098 193386)
 (symbols 48 35659 2)
 (strings 32 115227 22568)
 (string-bytes 1 4191025)
 (vectors 16 56437)
 (vector-slots 8 1945937 169102)
 (floats 8 525 180)
 (intervals 56 1065630 136)
 (buffers 1000 100))

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:02:39 -0400
> 
> >> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.

What does "rpm -ql emacs" display?

> Configured features:
> XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG CAIRO SOUND DBUS GSETTINGS GLIB NOTIFY
> INOTIFY ACL LIBSELINUX GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF
> ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 XDBE XIM MODULES THREADS XWIDGETS
> LIBSYSTEMD JSON PDUMPER LCMS2 GMP

This version definitely should have a .pdmp file.

Do you have the /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux-gnu
directory?  If so, what is its contents?

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 08:24:01 -0400
> 
> On 8/28/20 9:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> >> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> >> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:02:39 -0400
> >>
> >>>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
> > What does "rpm -ql emacs" display?
> # rpm -ql emacs
> /etc/skel/.gnu-emacs
> /usr/bin/ebrowse
> /usr/bin/emacs
> /usr/bin/emacsclient
> /usr/lib/emacs
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/hexl
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/rcs2log
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/update-game-score

So they use /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/ instead of
/usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.  I believe this is the old
standard.

OK, but this RPM is AFAIU simply busted: they didn't include the
emacs.pdmp file, which is now a must, and AFAIU should have been in
/usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.

(Not the reason for your problems, but I see that the Info files of
the manuals that come with Emacs are also not there.  So you have no
documentation of Emacs 27.1 installed.)

So please take this up with the distro which you are using: either
they made a mistake or you didn't install everything you need to for
Emacs 27.1 to be operable.

It would be meaningless to try to solve the other problems you had
during startup, before you resolve this fundamental installation
problem.  Emacs 27 is not supposed to be used without the .pdmp file.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[ken]

On 8/29/20 8:47 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 08:24:01 -0400
>>
>> On 8/28/20 9:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>>>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>>>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:02:39 -0400
>>>>
>>>>>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>> What does "rpm -ql emacs" display?
>> # rpm -ql emacs
>> /etc/skel/.gnu-emacs
>> /usr/bin/ebrowse
>> /usr/bin/emacs
>> /usr/bin/emacsclient
>> /usr/lib/emacs
>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1
>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/hexl
>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/rcs2log
>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/update-game-score
> So they use /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/ instead of
> /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.  I believe this is the old
> standard.
>
> OK, but this RPM is AFAIU simply busted: they didn't include the
> emacs.pdmp file, which is now a must, and AFAIU should have been in
> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.
There is this:

# ll /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
total 30812
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-x11.pdmp
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    14576 Aug 20 20:20 hexl
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    21156 Aug 20 20:20 rcs2log
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    23016 Aug 20 20:20 update-game-score

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:02:51 -0400
> 
> On 8/29/20 8:47 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> >> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> >> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 08:24:01 -0400
> >>
> >> On 8/28/20 9:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> >>>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> >>>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:02:39 -0400
> >>>>
> >>>>>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
> >>> What does "rpm -ql emacs" display?
> >> # rpm -ql emacs
> >> /etc/skel/.gnu-emacs
> >> /usr/bin/ebrowse
> >> /usr/bin/emacs
> >> /usr/bin/emacsclient
> >> /usr/lib/emacs
> >> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1
> >> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
> >> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/hexl
> >> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/rcs2log
> >> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/update-game-score
> > So they use /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/ instead of
> > /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.  I believe this is the old
> > standard.
> >
> > OK, but this RPM is AFAIU simply busted: they didn't include the
> > emacs.pdmp file, which is now a must, and AFAIU should have been in
> > /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.
> There is this:
> 
> # ll /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
> total 30812
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-x11.pdmp
> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    14576 Aug 20 20:20 hexl
> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    21156 Aug 20 20:20 rcs2log
> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    23016 Aug 20 20:20 update-game-score

But these *.pdmp files were not in the RPM whose contents you've
shown.  So where did they come from?

And your Emacs executable is named just 'emacs', so it is not clear
which of the *.pdmp files belongs to it.  maybe try renaming them one
by one to emacs.pdmp and see if one of them stops those "Loading
FOO..." messages from appearing.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[Yuri Khan]

On Sun, 30 Aug 2020 at 01:13, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:

> > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp
> > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp
> > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-x11.pdmp

> But these *.pdmp files were not in the RPM whose contents you've
> shown.  So where did they come from?

I do not know about SUSE but Debian does a similar thing. Emacs
variants compiled with or without GTK+ or X11 are distributed as
separate packages, with the Emacs binary named /usr/bin/emacs-gtk,
/usr/bin/emacs-nox, etc. Then, the mechanism called “alternatives”
sets up /usr/bin/emacs as a symlink to /etc/alternatives/emacs, which
in turn is a symlink to /usr/bin/emacs-whatever.

The Debian alternatives system makes it possible to declare a group of
related links, e.g. so that emacs.pdmp is a symlink to a symlink to
emacs-gtk.pdmp if and only if emacs is a symlink to a symlink to
emacs-gtk.

It seems the SUSE alternatives system is very similar; maybe SUSE
packagers should add the .pdmp to the alternatives group for Emacs?

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Yuri Khan <yuri.v.khan@gmail.com>
> Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2020 01:59:33 +0700
> Cc: help-gnu-emacs <help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
> 
> On Sun, 30 Aug 2020 at 01:13, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> 
> > > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp
> > > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp
> > > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-x11.pdmp
> 
> > But these *.pdmp files were not in the RPM whose contents you've
> > shown.  So where did they come from?
> 
> I do not know about SUSE but Debian does a similar thing. Emacs
> variants compiled with or without GTK+ or X11 are distributed as
> separate packages, with the Emacs binary named /usr/bin/emacs-gtk,
> /usr/bin/emacs-nox, etc. Then, the mechanism called “alternatives”
> sets up /usr/bin/emacs as a symlink to /etc/alternatives/emacs, which
> in turn is a symlink to /usr/bin/emacs-whatever.
> 
> The Debian alternatives system makes it possible to declare a group of
> related links, e.g. so that emacs.pdmp is a symlink to a symlink to
> emacs-gtk.pdmp if and only if emacs is a symlink to a symlink to
> emacs-gtk.
> 
> It seems the SUSE alternatives system is very similar; maybe SUSE
> packagers should add the .pdmp to the alternatives group for Emacs?

I don't know what they do, but it doesn't seem to work for the OP:
Emacs doesn't find its pdumper file.  So it's some kind of
installation problem, and the best place to report it is to the people
who are responsible for the distro he is using.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[Togan Muftuoglu via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

>>>>> "EZ" == Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>> 
>> # ll /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux total 30812 -rw-r--r-- 1 root
>> root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064
>> Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20
>> emacs-x11.pdmp -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    14576 Aug 20 20:20 hexl -rwxr-xr-x
>> 1 root root    21156 Aug 20 20:20 rcs2log -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    23016
>> Aug 20 20:20 update-game-score

EZ> But these *.pdmp files were not in the RPM whose contents you've shown. So
EZ> where did they come from?

EZ> And your Emacs executable is named just 'emacs', so it is not clear which
EZ> of the *.pdmp files belongs to it. maybe try renaming them one by one to
EZ> emacs.pdmp and see if one of them stops those "Loading FOO..." messages
EZ> from appearing.

No way this is not the solution for a problem that you have not understood !

As the Emacs executable in an openSUSE  system is a shell script only 

The problem is not with the emacs package but somehow the original poster had
not installed the needed parts.

install emacs-nox if the intention is to run with no X
install emacs-x11 which will have emacs-gtk and emacs-x11 variations
install emacs-info to get the info packages.

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: needing emacs.pdmp & other

[ken]

On 8/29/20 2:13 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 12:02:51 -0400
>>
>> On 8/29/20 8:47 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>>>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>>>> Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2020 08:24:01 -0400
>>>>
>>>> On 8/28/20 9:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>>>>>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:02:39 -0400
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>>>> What does "rpm -ql emacs" display?
>>>> # rpm -ql emacs
>>>> /etc/skel/.gnu-emacs
>>>> /usr/bin/ebrowse
>>>> /usr/bin/emacs
>>>> /usr/bin/emacsclient
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/hexl
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/rcs2log
>>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/update-game-score
>>> So they use /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/ instead of
>>> /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.  I believe this is the old
>>> standard.
>>>
>>> OK, but this RPM is AFAIU simply busted: they didn't include the
>>> emacs.pdmp file, which is now a must, and AFAIU should have been in
>>> /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/.
>> There is this:
>>
>> # ll /usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
>> total 30812
>> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10667896 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-gtk.pdmp
>> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10158064 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-nox.pdmp
>> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10656232 Aug 20 20:20 emacs-x11.pdmp
>> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    14576 Aug 20 20:20 hexl
>> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    21156 Aug 20 20:20 rcs2log
>> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root    23016 Aug 20 20:20 update-game-score
> But these *.pdmp files were not in the RPM whose contents you've
> shown.  So where did they come from?
# pwd; rpm -qf *.pdmp
/usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux
emacs-x11-27.1-2.1.x86_64
emacs-nox-27.1-2.1.x86_64
emacs-x11-27.1-2.1.x86_64

And evidently, emacs is broken out into several packages:

# rpm -qa|grep emacs
emacs-x11-27.1-2.1.x86_64
emacs-info-27.1-2.1.noarch
emacs-apel-10.8-2.6.noarch
emacs-nox-27.1-2.1.x86_64
emacs-27.1-2.1.x86_64
emacs-el-27.1-2.1.noarch
emacs-auctex-12.2-1.1.noarch

Here's brief info on those packages:

# for f in $(rpm -qa|grep emacs); do echo RPM info on $f :; rpm -qi $f;
echo =================; done
RPM info on emacs-x11-27.1-2.1.x86_64 :
Name        : emacs-x11
Version     : 27.1
Release     : 2.1
Architecture: x86_64
Install Date: Fri Aug 28 08:47:46 2020
Group       : Productivity/Text/Editors
Size        : 33929391
License     : GPL-3.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Thu Aug 20 20:22:47 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-27.1-2.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Thu Aug 20 20:00:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb18
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
Summary     : GNU Emacs: Emacs binary with X Window System Support
Description :
Call it

Emacs

Love it or leave it. This is the Emacs binary with X Window System
Support.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-info-27.1-2.1.noarch :
Name        : emacs-info
Version     : 27.1
Release     : 2.1
Architecture: noarch
Install Date: Fri Aug 28 08:31:38 2020
Group       : Productivity/Text/Editors
Size        : 4872696
License     : GPL-3.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Thu Aug 20 20:22:47 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-27.1-2.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Thu Aug 20 20:00:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb18
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
Summary     : Info files for GNU Emacs
Description :
This package contains all the Info files for GNU Emacs. These files can
be read online with GNU Emacs. They describe Emacs and some of its
modes.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-apel-10.8-2.6.noarch :
Name        : emacs-apel
Version     : 10.8
Release     : 2.6
Architecture: noarch
Install Date: Thu Aug  6 01:59:37 2020
Group       : Productivity/Editors/Emacs
Size        : 472441
License     : GPL-2.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Sat May 30 22:29:11 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-apel-10.8-2.6.src.rpm
Build Date  : Sat May 30 22:29:01 2020
Build Host  : lamb60
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://git.chise.org/elisp/apel
Summary     : A Portable Emacs Library
Description :
A Portable Emacs Library
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-nox-27.1-2.1.x86_64 :
Name        : emacs-nox
Version     : 27.1
Release     : 2.1
Architecture: x86_64
Install Date: Fri Aug 28 08:47:52 2020
Group       : Productivity/Text/Editors
Size        : 15671224
License     : GPL-3.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Thu Aug 20 20:22:47 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-27.1-2.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Thu Aug 20 20:00:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb18
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
Summary     : GNU Emacs-nox: An Emacs Binary without X Window System Support
Description :
Eight Megabytes And Constantly Swapping. Call it

emacs-nox

Love it or leave it.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-27.1-2.1.x86_64 :
Name        : emacs
Version     : 27.1
Release     : 2.1
Architecture: x86_64
Install Date: Fri Aug 28 08:47:04 2020
Group       : Productivity/Text/Editors
Size        : 74741020
License     : GPL-3.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Thu Aug 20 20:22:46 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-27.1-2.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Thu Aug 20 20:00:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb18
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
Summary     : GNU Emacs Base Package
Description :
Basic package for the GNU Emacs editor. Requires emacs-x11 or
emacs-nox.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-el-27.1-2.1.noarch :
Name        : emacs-el
Version     : 27.1
Release     : 2.1
Architecture: noarch
Install Date: Fri Aug 28 08:48:42 2020
Group       : Productivity/Text/Editors
Size        : 16032458
License     : GPL-3.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Thu Aug 20 20:22:46 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-27.1-2.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Thu Aug 20 20:00:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb18
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
Summary     : Several Lisp Files for GNU Emacs
Description :
Several Lisp files not needed for running GNU Emacs. Most of these
files are pre-byte compiled and therefore not necessary.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================
RPM info on emacs-auctex-12.2-1.1.noarch :
Name        : emacs-auctex
Version     : 12.2
Release     : 1.1
Architecture: noarch
Install Date: Tue Aug 18 16:30:15 2020
Group       : Productivity/Editors/Emacs
Size        : 33096040
License     : GPL-2.0-or-later
Signature   : RSA/SHA256, Sat Aug 15 16:05:36 2020, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284
Source RPM  : emacs-auctex-12.2-1.1.src.rpm
Build Date  : Sat Aug 15 16:01:15 2020
Build Host  : lamb51
Packager    : https://bugs.opensuse.org
Vendor      : openSUSE
URL         : http://www.gnu.org/software/auctex
Summary     : AUC TeX: An Emacs Extension
Description :
These macros make it easier for you to write TeX documents with GNU
Emacs.    Documentation can be found under:

/usr/share/doc/packages/emacs-auctex/

and in the dvi files math-ref.dvi and tex-ref.dvi (reference cards) and
in the info file auctex in emacs info-mode.

AuC TeX is integrated in XEmacs 19.15 and higher, so these packages may
not be installed concurrently.    Note that the binary formats of the
byte-compiled lisp files of the two emacs editors are incompatible, so
you cannot use this package for XEmacs.
Distribution: openSUSE Tumbleweed
=================




>
> And your Emacs executable is named just 'emacs', so it is not clear
> which of the *.pdmp files belongs to it.  maybe try renaming them one
> by one to emacs.pdmp and see if one of them stops those "Loading
> FOO..." messages from appearing.

It looks like one purpose of the pdmp fle is to interface with the
system's window manager.  The window manager on this system is gnome, so
it would seem that either emacs-gtk.pdmp or emacs-x11.pdmp, but I
haven't been able to determine which.  And yeah, I thought to create a
symlink from one of those to emacs.pdmp, but then read this from
/usr/share/doc/packages/emacs/doc/NEWS:

** Emacs now uses a "portable dumper" instead of unexec.
This improves compatibility with memory allocation on modern systems,
and in particular better supports the Address Space Layout
Randomization (ASLR) feature, a security technique used by most modern
operating systems.

When built with the portable dumping support (which is the default),
Emacs looks for the "emacs.pdmp" file, generated during the build, in
its data directory at startup, and loads the dumped state from there.
The new command-line argument '--dump-file=FILE' allows specifying a
non-default ".pdmp" file to load the state from; see the node
"(emacs) Initial Options" in the Emacs manual for more information.

An Emacs started via a dump file can create a new dump file only if it
was invoked with the '-batch' option.  (This is a temporary
limitation; we plan on lifting it in a future release.)

Although the portable dumper has been tested, it may have a bug on
unusual platforms.  If you require traditional unexec dumping you can
use the configure-time option '--with-dumping=unexec'; however, please
file a bug report describing the situation, as unexec dumping is
deprecated, and we plan on removing it in some future release.

So trying

emacs --dump-file=/usr/lib/emacs/27.1/x86_64-suse-linux/emacs-gtk.pdmp
--debug-init &

I get just

Warning: game dir ’/var/games/emacs’: Permission denied

Loading desktop...done
Loading saveplace...done
...

Then it shows loading my own files into emacs buffers, but then some errors

Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 501) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1001) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 3006) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 2321) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 2821) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 2320) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 2314) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 3506) signaled (void-variable
bufname)

Then messages about what tramp's doing, then more errors

Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 501) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1001) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1501) signaled (void-variable
bufname)

Then more messages about tramp, then more errors

No docstring slot for jka-compr-handler
For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1281) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 1781) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 2149) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 4006) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 3122) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 3622) signaled (void-variable
bufname)
Error during redisplay: (jit-lock-function 80854) signaled
(void-variable bufname)

But emacs seems to be working, and from what I can see in just five
minutes, my ~/.emacs is also working now..

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[ken]

On 8/28/20 8:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 08:08:43 -0400
>>
>>>> Loading loadup.el (source)...
>>>> dump mode: nil
>>>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>> This indicates that Emacs cannot find the emacs.pdmp file.  You should
>>> fix this problem before you continue investigating any further
>>> problems, because when Emacs doesn't find its dump file, all kinds of
>>> weird problems can happen.  So everything you said until now is more
>>> or less unimportant, until you resolve the problem with the emacs.pdmp
>>> file.
>> Thanks, but I know nothing at all about this file, never heard of it. 
>> Looking for it:
>>
>> "locate emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>
>> "rpm -ql emacs|grep emacs.pdmp" returns nothing.
>>
>> So it appears I don't have it and never did.
> Very strange.  ...

In the past couple minutes these outputs from emacs appeared in the
terminal window where emacs was started:

(emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:48:53.531:
gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed

(emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:54:02.426:
gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed

(emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:54:40.994:
gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed

(emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:57:12.636:
gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed

Wisened emacs folk will certainly understand that better than I (given
that I don't have a clue).

Re: hork point in ~/.emacs: -Q and --debug outputs in terminal & *Messages*

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 09:13:52 -0400
> 
> In the past couple minutes these outputs from emacs appeared in the
> terminal window where emacs was started:
> 
> (emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:48:53.531:
> gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed
> 
> (emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:54:02.426:
> gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed
> 
> (emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:54:40.994:
> gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed
> 
> (emacs:14230): Gtk-CRITICAL **: 08:57:12.636:
> gtk_distribute_natural_allocation: assertion 'extra_space >= 0' failed
> 
> Wisened emacs folk will certainly understand that better than I (given
> that I don't have a clue).

I don't think this is related to your main problem.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[Robert Pluim]

>>>>> On Thu, 27 Aug 2020 13:17:47 -0400, ken <gebser@mousecar.com> said:
    ken> Uncle Web gave me an answer: it's a buffer emacs calls *Messages*. 

    ken> The first errors in it:

    ken> Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
    ken> Loading minibuffer...
    ken> Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
    ken> (void-function timerp)

You could try

(setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")

at the top of your .emacs. Although I suspect grepping through your
package code might be quicker (thatʼs typically somewhere under
"~/.emacs.d")

Roert

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[Noam Postavsky]

On Thu, 27 Aug 2020 at 13:41, Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com> wrote:

> You could try
>
> (setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")

I think this can't help because the debugger is suppressed during
redisplay (after all, if redisplay fails, how will you display the
debugger...)

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[ken]

On 8/27/20 1:41 PM, Robert Pluim wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 27 Aug 2020 13:17:47 -0400, ken <gebser@mousecar.com> said:
>     ken> ... buffer emacs calls *Messages*. 
>
>     ken> The first errors in it:
>
>     ken> Loading emacs-lisp/cl-generic...done
>     ken> Loading minibuffer...
>     ken> Error during redisplay: (clear-minibuffer-message) signaled
>     ken> (void-function timerp)
>
> You could try
>
> (setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")
>
> at the top of your .emacs. Although I suspect grepping through your
> package code might be quicker (thatʼs typically somewhere under
> "~/.emacs.d")
>
> Roert
Good suggestion about the text search, but "grep -ri timerp *" returned
nothing.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 06:50:34 -0400
> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> 
> > You could try
> >
> > (setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")
> >
> > at the top of your .emacs. Although I suspect grepping through your
> > package code might be quicker (thatʼs typically somewhere under
> > "~/.emacs.d")
> >
> > Roert
> Good suggestion about the text search, but "grep -ri timerp *" returned
> nothing.

As I said in another message, you should drop everything and first
resolve the problem with Emacs not finding its emacs.pdmp file.  That
long series of "Loading foo..." messages should never appear at
startup time.

How did you install Emacs? are there any symlinks or other redirection
methods involved in reaching the Emacs executable from its usual
place?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[ken]

On 8/28/20 7:17 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 06:50:34 -0400
>> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
>>
>>> You could try
>>>
>>> (setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")
>>>
>>> at the top of your .emacs. Although I suspect grepping through your
>>> package code might be quicker (thatʼs typically somewhere under
>>> "~/.emacs.d")
>>>
>>> Roert
>> Good suggestion about the text search, but "grep -ri timerp *" returned
>> nothing.
> As I said in another message, you should drop everything and first
> resolve the problem with Emacs not finding its emacs.pdmp file.  That
> long series of "Loading foo..." messages should never appear at
> startup time.
>
> How did you install Emacs? are there any symlinks or other redirection
> methods involved in reaching the Emacs executable from its usual
> place?
>
In another post in this thread I talked about emacs.pdmp in a bit more
detail... essentially I don't have that file on my system, nor was it
part of the install.

This system is fairly new, installed just a week or so ago:

# ll /etc/os-release
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 21 Aug 17 17:22 /etc/os-release ->
../usr/lib/os-release
# cat /etc/os-release
NAME="openSUSE Tumbleweed"
# VERSION="20200817"
ID="opensuse-tumbleweed"
ID_LIKE="opensuse suse"
VERSION_ID="20200817"
PRETTY_NAME="openSUSE Tumbleweed"
ANSI_COLOR="0;32"
CPE_NAME="cpe:/o:opensuse:tumbleweed:20200817"
BUG_REPORT_URL="https://bugs.opensuse.org"
HOME_URL="https://www.opensuse.org/"
LOGO="distributor-logo"

# whereis -b emacs
emacs: /usr/bin/emacs /usr/lib/emacs /usr/share/emacs
# ls -ld /usr/bin/emacs /usr/lib/emacs /usr/share/emacs
-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 4334 Apr 26  2017 /usr/bin/emacs
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root    8 Aug 18 16:26 /usr/lib/emacs
drwxr-xr-x 1 root root   42 Aug 18 16:26 /usr/share/emacs

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 08:26:22 -0400
> 
> This system is fairly new, installed just a week or so ago:
> 
> # ll /etc/os-release
> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 21 Aug 17 17:22 /etc/os-release ->
> ../usr/lib/os-release
> # cat /etc/os-release
> NAME="openSUSE Tumbleweed"
> # VERSION="20200817"
> ID="opensuse-tumbleweed"
> ID_LIKE="opensuse suse"
> VERSION_ID="20200817"
> PRETTY_NAME="openSUSE Tumbleweed"
> ANSI_COLOR="0;32"
> CPE_NAME="cpe:/o:opensuse:tumbleweed:20200817"
> BUG_REPORT_URL="https://bugs.opensuse.org"
> HOME_URL="https://www.opensuse.org/"
> LOGO="distributor-logo"
> 
> # whereis -b emacs
> emacs: /usr/bin/emacs /usr/lib/emacs /usr/share/emacs
> # ls -ld /usr/bin/emacs /usr/lib/emacs /usr/share/emacs
> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 4334 Apr 26  2017 /usr/bin/emacs
> drwxr-xr-x 1 root root    8 Aug 18 16:26 /usr/lib/emacs
> drwxr-xr-x 1 root root   42 Aug 18 16:26 /usr/share/emacs

What do you have in /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/, in a subdirectory that
corresponds to your architecture ?

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs: timerp

[ken]

On 8/28/20 8:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> What do you have in /usr/libexec/emacs/27.1/, in a subdirectory that
> corresponds to your architecture ?
# cd /usr/libexec/emacs/
-bash: cd: /usr/libexec/emacs/: No such file or directory

Is there a particular file we're looking for?  I might hunt it down that
way.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs -> emacs.pdmp

[ken]

On 8/28/20 7:17 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> From: ken <gebser@mousecar.com>
>> Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2020 06:50:34 -0400
>> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
>>
>>> You could try
>>>
>>> (setq debug-on-message "Error during redisplay")
>>>
>>> at the top of your .emacs. Although I suspect grepping through your
>>> package code might be quicker (thatʼs typically somewhere under
>>> "~/.emacs.d")
>>>
>>> Roert
>> Good suggestion about the text search, but "grep -ri timerp *" returned
>> nothing.
> As I said in another message, you should drop everything and first
> resolve the problem with Emacs not finding its emacs.pdmp file.  That
> long series of "Loading foo..." messages should never appear at
> startup time.
>
> How did you install Emacs? are there any symlinks or other redirection
> methods involved in reaching the Emacs executable from its usual
> place?

Maybe also worth mentioning:

$ emacs --version ; rpm -q emacs
GNU Emacs 27.1
Copyright (C) 2020 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
GNU Emacs comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
You may redistribute copies of GNU Emacs
under the terms of the GNU General Public License.
For more information about these matters, see the file named COPYING.
emacs-27.1-1.1.x86_64

I'll check if there are any upgrades and if so do them.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

ken wrote:

> In another thread I spoke too soon about my
> ~/.emacs fully working.  A lot of it isn't being
> executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
> some code is no longer working (since my recent
> emacs upgrade).  Is there some really good method
> or log file or something else which would help
> finding where the hork point is?

You can do the so-called binary search, which is
a fancy name for this method

  code_1
  code_2
  code_n
  code_m

then do

  code_1
  code_2
  ;; code_n
  ;; code_m

if it still doesn't work, problem is in 1 or 2, so

  code_1
  ;; code_2
  ;; code_n
  ;; code_m

if it ... etc

And: the better you write the code to begin with, the
better this method will work :)

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[ken]

On 8/26/20 4:52 PM, Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text
editor wrote:
> ken wrote:
>
>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my
>> ~/.emacs fully working.  A lot of it isn't being
>> executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
>> some code is no longer working (since my recent
>> emacs upgrade).  Is there some really good method
>> or log file or something else which would help
>> finding where the hork point is?
> You can do the so-called binary search, which is
> a fancy name for this method
>
>   code_1
>   code_2
>   code_n
>   code_m
>
> then do
>
>   code_1
>   code_2
>   ;; code_n
>   ;; code_m
>
> if it still doesn't work, problem is in 1 or 2, so
>
>   code_1
>   ;; code_2
>   ;; code_n
>   ;; code_m
>
> if it ... etc

Yes, good.  I know that technique, and I think it's better known as,
"isolating the problem."  I've done lots of error chasing using that
method, not only looking at code, but also looking for a problem with a
car, or in my house's electrical system, fixing the washing machine,
lots and lots of places.  Everywhere really.  However, my ~/.emacs is a
bit over a thousand lines long (well, more than half is probably
documentation, but still), a lot of code to look at line by line, even
if the binary method narrows it down to roughly a third of those lines.

What I've done in the past and could still do:  I put a line in my
~/.emacs like this:

(set-cursor-color "red") ;;if cursor isn't the spec'd color, error is above

In fact, I can put two or three such lines in my code, using different
colors (blue, limegreen, whatever), telling me (very approximately)
where the problem is depending upon what color the cursor is.  It's also
much easier to find and remove-back-to-normal my .emacs.  But frankly,
with so much code, even this method is still tedious.

Most programming languages has some facility which actually pinpoints,
down to the line, sometimes down to the character, where a coding error
is, at least where the compiler or interpreter thinks it is.  I thought
shure elisp would have something like that.

>
> And: the better you write the code to begin with, the
> better this method will work :)

The code in my ~/.emacs (and elsewhere) has been working fine for
years.  It's only when I do a major upgrade to emacs that I have these
problems... for some strange reason newer emacs versions remove working
functions that my code uses, so obviously it's not going to work
anymore.  I've been using C and bash as my two main progamming platforms
for decades and have never had such a problem.  Bash is planning on
obsoleting some small bit of code, but they've been warning people about
it for over five years now.  That much is considerate.  On the other
hand, I wrote one small piece of code in Tk/Tcl and another for Gnome
and both of them made changes which obsoleted support code (or
libraries) which made my code useless.. so I doubt I'll ever write code
for either of those platforms again.  Same reason I'd never choose to
live in a hurricane zone.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Eric Abrahamsen]

ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:

> On 8/26/20 4:52 PM, Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text
> editor wrote:
>> ken wrote:
>>
>>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my
>>> ~/.emacs fully working.  A lot of it isn't being
>>> executed.  This, to my understanding, means that
>>> some code is no longer working (since my recent
>>> emacs upgrade).  Is there some really good method
>>> or log file or something else which would help
>>> finding where the hork point is?
>> You can do the so-called binary search, which is
>> a fancy name for this method
>>
>>   code_1
>>   code_2
>>   code_n
>>   code_m
>>
>> then do
>>
>>   code_1
>>   code_2
>>   ;; code_n
>>   ;; code_m
>>
>> if it still doesn't work, problem is in 1 or 2, so
>>
>>   code_1
>>   ;; code_2
>>   ;; code_n
>>   ;; code_m
>>
>> if it ... etc
>
> Yes, good.  I know that technique, and I think it's better known as,
> "isolating the problem."

No, it's definitely known as binary search, because it's a more specific
technique than just commenting out random stuff and hoping. You comment
half the file, see if the problem persists. Whether it does or not,
you're now able to comment three quarters of the file, then seven
eighths, and by this point you've usually found it. No matter how big
the file, it's relatively few steps to find the problem.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Eric Abrahamsen wrote:

> [...] it's definitely known as binary search,
> because it's a more specific technique than just
> commenting out random stuff and hoping.

The Wikipedia article [1] seem to
insist on a "sorted array". I didn't read the rest
of it, tho, maybe they mention other areas and/or
informal use of the word.

It is a divide-and-conquer algorithm, right? [2]

> No matter how big the file, it's relatively few
> steps to find the problem.

"Binary search runs in logarithmic time in the worst
case", or O(log n) where n here would be the number
of lines, I guess.


[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_search_algorithm

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divide-and-conquer_algorithm

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Carson Chittom]

ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:

> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully 
> working.  A
> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, 
> means that
> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade). 
> Is
> there some really good method or log file or something else 
> which would
> help finding where the hork point is?

I will admit that I'm still at the stage of copy-and-pasting 
others' configurations to get what I want.

Occasionally it happens that that Emacs barfs on that 
configuration.  So I just do

emacs -Q

and then visit ~/.emacs.  I then try to C-x C-e every individual 
statement, until I find the one that Emacs doesn't like.

RE: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Drew Adams]

> emacs -Q
> and then visit ~/.emacs.  I then try to C-x C-e every individual
> statement, until I find the one that Emacs doesn't like.

Unless you have only a few such statements, see
what others have suggested as an alternative:
binary search.  Use `M-x comment-region' to
comment out 1/2, then 3/4, 7/8, 15/16,... of the
file, till you find just what caused the problem.

If you use `C-u M-x comment-region' it UNcomments.

This is very quick, even if it doesn't seem so
at first.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Drew Adams wrote:

> Unless you have only a few such statements, see
> what others have suggested as an alternative:
> binary search. Use `M-x comment-region' to comment
> out 1/2, then 3/4, 7/8, 15/16,... of the file, till
> you find just what caused the problem.
>
> If you use `C-u M-x comment-region' it UNcomments.

Try M-; for `comment-dwim'. It comments and then
uncomments if the region contains a comment. Also,
this preserves comments already there. So if you have

  ;; parens
  
  (require 'paren)
  (show-paren-mode t)
  (setq show-paren-delay  0)
  
  ;; fanfare / splash
  
  (setq inhibit-startup-screen t)
  (setq inhibit-startup-echo-area-message "incal")
  (setq byte-compile-verbose nil)

do M-;

  ;; ;; parens
  ;; 
  ;; (require 'paren)
  ;; (show-paren-mode t)
  ;; (setq show-paren-delay  0)
  ;; 
  ;; ;; fanfare / splash
  ;; 
  ;; (setq inhibit-startup-screen t)
  ;; (setq inhibit-startup-echo-area-message "incal")
  ;; (setq byte-compile-verbose nil)

do M-; again

  ;; parens

  (require 'paren)
  (show-paren-mode t)
  (setq show-paren-delay  0)

  ;; fanfare / splash

  (setq inhibit-startup-screen t)
  (setq inhibit-startup-echo-area-message "incal")
  (setq byte-compile-verbose nil)

M-; is also one of the most ergonomic keystrokes on
the keyboard, so make sure to use it often :)

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

RE: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Drew Adams]

[I really must remember that Reply All to you doesn't
send to the list, for some reason.  Sending again,
ccing it explicitly.]


> > If you use `C-u M-x comment-region' it UNcomments.
> 
> Try M-; for `comment-dwim'. It comments and then
> uncomments if the region contains a comment.

... which is not as good as `comment-region', IMHO.
I use `M-;' only for eol comments.  IMO, it's not
really made for block (un)commenting.

`comment-region' works well with nesting comment
blocks - it unnests a given level of nesting.
(Almost like having Common Lisp's `#|' and `|#'.)

`M-;' commenting or uncommenting a line in the
region, depending on whether the line is commented,
is never what I want.  It's a poor substitute for
uncommenting a given level of commenting.  YMMV.

> Also, this preserves comments already there. So if you have
> ... do M-;
> ... do M-; again ...

`comment-region' does all of that, & more, & better.

I actually use my `comment-region-lines', which I
bind to `C-x C-;':

(defun comment-region-lines (beg end &optional arg)
  "Like `comment-region', but comment/uncomment whole lines."
  (interactive "*r\nP")
  (when (> beg end)
    (setq beg  (prog1 end (setq end  beg))))
  (let ((bol  (save-excursion 
                (goto-char beg) 
                (line-beginning-position)))
        (eol  (save-excursion 
                (goto-char end) 
                (if (bolp) (point) (line-end-position)))))
    (comment-region bol eol arg)))
 
> M-; is also one of the most ergonomic keystrokes on
> the keyboard, so make sure to use it often :)

`M-;' has been there forever for eol comments, long
before they added half-baked region-(un)commenting
behavior to it.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Drew Adams wrote:

>> Try M-; for `comment-dwim'. It comments and then
>> uncomments if the region contains a comment.
>
> ... which is not as good as `comment-region', IMHO.
> I use `M-;' only for eol comments. IMO, it's not
> really made for block (un)commenting.

? `comment-dwim':

  If the region is active and ‘transient-mark-mode’
  is on, call ‘comment-region’ (unless it only
  consists of comments, in which case it calls
  ‘uncomment-region’).

> YMMV

I don't think so :)

> (defun comment-region-lines (beg end &optional arg)
>   "Like `comment-region', but comment/uncomment
>   whole lines." [...]

What do you mean by "whole lines"? Empty lines?
If so,

  (setq comment-empty-lines t)

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

RE: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Drew Adams]

> ? `comment-dwim':
> 
>   If the region is active and ‘transient-mark-mode’
>   is on, call ‘comment-region’ (unless it only
>   consists of comments, in which case it calls
>   ‘uncomment-region’).

Right: "unless it..."

I want it to comment when I tell it to comment,
including when it may already be commented -
nested comment blocks.  And I want it to uncomment
when I tell it to uncomment.  This particular DWIM
doesn't do-what-I-want.  (It may do-what-you-want.)

> > (defun comment-region-lines (beg end &optional arg)
> >   "Like `comment-region', but comment/uncomment
> >   whole lines." [...]
> 
> What do you mean by "whole lines"?

What the code says.  Regardless of the columns
of point and mark, their lines and the lines
between them are commented, from bol.

(let ((bol  (save-excursion 
              (goto-char beg) 
              (line-beginning-position)))
      (eol  (save-excursion 
              (goto-char end) 
              (if (bolp) (point) (line-end-position)))))
  (comment-region bol eol arg))

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Drew Adams wrote:

>> ? `comment-dwim':
>> 
>>   If the region is active and ‘transient-mark-mode’
>>   is on, call ‘comment-region’ (unless it only
>>   consists of comments, in which case it calls
>>   ‘uncomment-region’).
>
> Right: "unless it..."
>
> I want it to comment when I tell it to comment,
> including when it may already be commented - nested
> comment blocks. And I want it to uncomment when
> I tell it to uncomment. This particular DWIM
> doesn't do-what-I-want. (It may do-what-you-want.)

It already uses the functions you recommend.

What else do you think a DWIM comment function should
base its behavior on, if not if the region is or
isn't already comments?

> What the code says.  Regardless of the columns
> of point and mark, their lines and the lines
> between them are commented, from bol.

Ah, I recognize this from somewhere else, namely

(defun sort-whole-lines (start end)
  (interactive "r")
  (save-excursion
    (let ((s (progn (goto-char start) (line-beginning-position)))
          (e (progn (goto-char end)   (line-end-position))) )
      (sort-lines nil s e) ))) ; [1]

With comments for some reason, I never felt the need
to do it. But it should make sense, because when do
you ever want to [un]comment say lines, a, b, and c,
and then HALF of line d?


[1] https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/sort-my.el

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Ihor Radchenko]

> Occasionally it happens that that Emacs barfs on that 
> configuration.  So I just do
>
> emacs -Q
>
> and then visit ~/.emacs.  I then try to C-x C-e every individual 
> statement, until I find the one that Emacs doesn't like.

There is bug-hunter package that automates this process for you.

Best,
Ihor


Carson Chittom <carson@wistly.net> writes:

> ken <gebser@mousecar.com> writes:
>
>> In another thread I spoke too soon about my ~/.emacs fully 
>> working.  A
>> lot of it isn't being executed.  This, to my understanding, 
>> means that
>> some code is no longer working (since my recent emacs upgrade). 
>> Is
>> there some really good method or log file or something else 
>> which would
>> help finding where the hork point is?
>
> I will admit that I'm still at the stage of copy-and-pasting 
> others' configurations to get what I want.
>
> Occasionally it happens that that Emacs barfs on that 
> configuration.  So I just do
>
> emacs -Q
>
> and then visit ~/.emacs.  I then try to C-x C-e every individual 
> statement, until I find the one that Emacs doesn't like.

Re: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Carson Chittom wrote:

> I will admit that I'm still at the stage of
> copy-and-pasting others' configurations to get what
> I want.

Here, it is called killing and yanking :)

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

RE: finding the hork point in ~/.emacs

[Drew Adams]

> > I will admit that I'm still at the stage of
> > copy-and-pasting others' configurations to get what
> > I want.
> 
> Here, it is called killing and yanking :)

Killing and yanking others...

Oh! others' configurations, sorry.