From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: floyd@barrow.com (Floyd L. Davidson) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: emacs for everything? Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 04:20:48 -0900 Organization: __________ Message-ID: <87zn1i6ibz.fld@barrow.com> References: <10pg1ivp03kqa69@corp.supernews.com> <87u0rq14xu.fsf@163.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1100611309 32161 80.91.229.6 (16 Nov 2004 13:21:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 13:21:49 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Nov 16 14:21:39 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1CU3H9-0003jV-00 for ; Tue, 16 Nov 2004 14:21:39 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CU3Pt-0001Ky-OH for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 16 Nov 2004 08:30:41 -0500 Original-Path: shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!postnews.google.com!news3.google.com!news.glorb.com!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!falcon.america.net!eagle.america.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help User-Agent: gnus 5.10.6/XEmacs 21.4.15/Linux 2.6.5 Cancel-Lock: sha1:Xjo83Sez7/lnrq2KhmiGC5QyuwA= Original-Lines: 84 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.124.156.209 Original-X-Trace: eagle.america.net 1100611382 209.124.156.209 (Tue, 16 Nov 2004 08:23:02 EST) Original-NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2004 08:23:02 EST Original-Xref: shelby.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:126654 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:22049 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:22049 William Xuuu wrote: >hsh@freecode.dk (Henrik S. Hansen) writes: > >> Mike writes: >> >> Another thing I've wondered about is, do people use Emacs in (primarily) >> X or console? >> >> For me it's the console. > >Me too, :-) The fontify, the fonts, are much much nicer under console than >X. And the black background, good for eyes. I do most things within Emacs >under console, except interactive bash, and some stuffs that have to be >done under X, like viewing pdf, manipulating pictures, web browsing with >pictures, etc. I simply do not understand the sanity in what you have described! That is a straight jacket! Except I'll grant that fonts in X are a problem. I've spent hours and hours finding fonts (for any given screen resolution) that provide a nice, readable screen under both (x)emacs and in an xterm. But it is *definitely* worth it. The "black background, good for eyes" comment is correct, but misplaced. Under X I use goldenrod2 as the foreground color along with black for the background, and it is much like the old "amber" monochrome monitors of years ago. Which is to say, even better than white on black, for the eyes! But what you are missing by using a console is the extreme versatility provided by a good window manager under X. Your message headers indicate that you are using Linux, which means you have to switch between a console and X with a rather clunky mechanism, and have extremely limited use of screen space when in the console. What I do, using fvwm2 as a window manager, is set up a desktop manager with a 1x15 matrix of virtual desktops. The desktop manager is on the left side of the screen, and is sticky. Hence I need about 1/8 inch of the left side to be clear in order to use it with a mouse (and none of it needs to be clear to use the keyboard to switch desktops). At this moment I have 4 web (opera) browsers open in four different desktops (all as different users). I have at least a dozen instances of an xterm running in various windows. At a glance I can see which desktop I am in, and with the click of a mouse I can move to a different one, or I can use control-arrow keys to scroll up or down through the list. (If at any time I want a window in any desktop moved to the same desktop as another window, that is an almost instant operation requiring about three clicks of the mouse to do.) Consider the effort that you have to go through on a console if you want to switch to a web browser. I can select any of four of them with a single mouse click. And I could have them all stacked up in the same desktop in short order too, which simply cannot be done on a console. Actually, the description above of where the desktop manager is located isn't quite true anymore. I do use that on a couple of machines, but my main workstation has dual head video, with two 17 inch monitors. Right now I am in the second down virtual desktop, and have xemacs running gnus on the left monitor, using up about 95% of the screen. On the right monitor is the desktop manager, along with xcalc, xload, xsysinfo, a large clock, xmms, 5 buttons for local programs, and an xterm that is logged into my firewall. Everything on the right monitor is sticky and stays in place regardless of which of the 15 desktops I'm in at any given time. All of which is to say that fvwm2 under X is a *far* more versatile window manager than emacs is! Emacs *is* great though, and if for some reason one is 1) logged in remotely or 2) using a simple terminal, (all of which was very commonly the case back when the "emacs as a window manager" concept originated) then it is *really* nice to have all the facilities of emacs available. But using it on a typical system console, with X available, is wearing a straight jacket. -- Floyd L. Davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) floyd@barrow.com