From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Pascal J. Bourguignon" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Packages, release notes, etc Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2015 04:15:36 +0200 Organization: Informatimago Message-ID: <87y4gd7lbr.fsf@kuiper.lan.informatimago.com> References: <87io7iochh.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1441938031 32520 80.91.229.3 (11 Sep 2015 02:20:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2015 02:20:31 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 11 04:20:27 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaDws-00078G-OK for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 11 Sep 2015 04:20:22 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53489 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZaDws-0000Rf-67 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2015 22:20:22 -0400 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 46 Original-X-Trace: individual.net 9VUZ5U6LPAtt8EZKfFC+DwtgJKu6NCmxcqEiug69CcSHn+NykP Cancel-Lock: sha1:NmUyMWVmMWQxZDc1NmQ0ZmViM2RmODNkZWNhOTJjOWNjMjZlZTkxNw== sha1:S6MN8L0ajzBjZrbuWx85Yq6+nTQ= Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAQMAAABtzGvEAAAABlBMVEUAAAD///+l2Z/dAAAA oElEQVR4nK3OsRHCMAwF0O8YQufUNIQRGIAja9CxSA55AxZgFO4coMgYrEDDQZWPIlNAjwq9 033pbOBPtbXuB6PKNBn5gZkhGa86Z4x2wE67O+06WxGD/HCOGR0deY3f9Ijwwt7rNGNf6Oac l/GuZTF1wFGKiYYHKSFAkjIo1b6sCYS1sVmFhhhahKQssRjRT90ITWUk6vvK3RsPGs+M1RuR mV+hO/VvFAAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Accept-Language: fr, es, en User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3 (gnu/linux) Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:214858 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:107142 Archived-At: Joost Kremers writes: > Tassilo Horn wrote: >> But what's the purpose of the copyleft when I can release a derived work >> basing on GPL code under a GPL-compatible license which has no copyleft >> anymore, e.g., Apache License, Version 2.0? > > But what's a derived work? IANAL but according to Wikipedia a derivative > wokr includes (a significant portion of) the original work. In that > view, Emacs plugins, are not derivative works. > > IIUC the FSF argues that using a library in your program makes your > program a derivative work of that library. (It's why there's also an > LGPL.) In that view, something could be said for the argument that > plugins are derivative works, even though Emacs is strictly speaking > not a library. > > If you say that Emacs is essentially a virtual machine, then plugins > written by third parties are not derivative works, I think. I mean, > Oracles JVM is GPL, but I doubt that means that every program running on > it must also be GPL. OTOH most Emacs plugins aren't just programs that > happen to run on the Emacs VM, they're extensions modifying or extending > the functionality of Emacs itself. (There are a few packages that I > would consider actual programs running on top of Emacs, such as Gnus, > mu4e, magit, etc. To me, those are intuitively different from a package > such as e.g., markdown-mode or hydra, but the line is difficult to draw. > I'm myself not sure on what side of the line I'd put org-mode, for > example.) > > Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that it's not at all clear what the > legal status of Emacs packages is, and I'm pretty sure that if someone > were to publish a proprietary Emacs extension and the FSF would sue, > it'd be far from an open and shut case... Indeed, and given that the legal analysis of the existing cases, demonstrate that it all reduces to whether the judge considers to be in presence of a derived work or not (nonwithstanding any technicalities like linking, as I mentionned previously, a mere translation (in literature) is considered derived work, I'm sure you could make the case for source code too). -- __Pascal Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/ “The factory of the future will have only two employees, a man and a dog. The man will be there to feed the dog. The dog will be there to keep the man from touching the equipment.” -- Carl Bass CEO Autodesk