From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs history, and "Is Emacs difficult to learn?" Date: Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:27:30 +0200 Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server Message-ID: <87txj9qvml.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> References: <87y58pplcp.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <87fvuwgsv0.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <075751cf-97a3-4d01-8fb1-4ffbc0180f3f@googlegroups.com> <878v0oxfdw.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <87a9l4rs76.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <39e6407d-c4fd-4dc1-b47f-a1ba4119c7cb@googlegroups.com> <87iozqzjjq.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <871u6dpjar.fsf@VLAN-3434.student.uu.se> <14bebcfe-2311-4bb3-8154-4cc803962c71@googlegroups.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1375371016 24857 80.91.229.3 (1 Aug 2013 15:30:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2013 15:30:16 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 01 17:30:20 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1V4upX-0003wC-BS for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:30:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57542 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1V4upW-0007Vj-SP for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 11:30:18 -0400 X-Received: by 10.180.182.230 with SMTP id eh6mr4449644wic.3.1375370855672; Thu, 01 Aug 2013 08:27:35 -0700 (PDT) X-FeedAbuse: http://nntpfeed.proxad.net/abuse.pl feeded by 88.191.116.97 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!g3no2705535wic.0!news-out.google.com!ed8ni3515wic.0!nntp.google.com!proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!nntpfeed.proxad.net!dedibox.gegeweb.org!gegeweb.eu!gegeweb.org!aioe.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 51 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: SWN/nubmpQxYKwY7hPy4YA.user.speranza.aioe.org Original-X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.4 (gnu/linux) X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2 Cancel-Lock: sha1:IT+9tc1GFgOfkUrjJYpYo5dMcw8= Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:200360 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:92628 Archived-At: Rustom Mody writes: >> Yes, a struct is just a memory pattern. You are saying, a Lisp >> list isn't - is it moving around in memory, is it fragmented, or >> is allocation made dynamically based on the elements? Is that >> the difference? With pointers, isn't that what you get in C? >> Please explain. > > Well... I dont know if this is the best forum for these > discussions :-) > > In short: A language becomes more powerful when it has less... > > Think of registers and interrupts disappearing from assembly to C, > making C better than assembly in 95% use-cases. Now if you were > an assembly programmer, you would pooh-pooh a C (like) language: > "How can having less make it a better language?" > > It makes it better because one's thoughts have more clarity. > > You may remember the quote from Bruce Lee: I am not afraid of the > man who knows 10 thousand kicks. I am afraid of the man who has > practiced one kick 10 thousand times. Likewise in programming, > doing few things well gets you further than doing many things > sub-optimally. > > And so assignment disappearing from C to haskell makes haskell > programmers able to have better thoughts [Well they say 100% of > the time; I say 80% of the time ;-) ] > > I could go on eg why lisp can be C-like or haskell-like depending > on how you use it etc etc. Or answering > >> Are you saying: C doesn't have hash tables, search trees, etc., >> you have to make them yourself with data types and pointers, and >> put them into structs, and then have the algorithm traverse >> them, and all this you do manually, with no support from the >> language? > > However as I said this is getting too too OT for this group. > > If you want we can continue off-list. Do read my blog though > http://blog.languager.org/ in case you find may my ideas painful > to your delicate digestion :-) OK, the international press is content with that answer. -- Emanuel Berg - programmer (hire me! CV below) computer projects: http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 internet activity: http://home.student.uu.se/embe8573