From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: pirate bay, w3m, and the interface is just an interface (BEST post ever) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2014 23:08:03 +0100 Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server Message-ID: <87r3vrfid8.fsf@debian.uxu> References: <87k31v83eb.fsf@debian.uxu> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1419286229 18234 80.91.229.3 (22 Dec 2014 22:10:29 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2014 22:10:29 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 22 23:10:20 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3BBC-0003J0-EC for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 23:10:18 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42088 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3BBB-0002Q9-Ip for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 17:10:17 -0500 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!news.kjsl.com!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.mixmin.net!aioe.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 67 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: feB02bRejf23rfBm51Mt7Q.user.speranza.aioe.org Original-X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.4 (gnu/linux) X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2 Cancel-Lock: sha1:trAgVm9+CoFdBBp8dBI1au4MA2g= Mail-Copies-To: never Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:209422 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:101701 Archived-At: Paul Rankin writes: >> Look, I'm not advocating piracy - or saying you >> shouldn't do it, for that matter - I'm saying > > Look, you quite clearly are, which is quite > offensive for those of us who believe that all > people should be afforded equal rights under the > law, including that tiny minority who strive to > improve the world through the creation of art. It's > not up to you to decide that this minority does not > deserve the right to the work to which they give > their lives. > > Please refrain from posting such discriminatory > ideology to a public list. I'm not discriminating. It is a fact that some people can buy all material they want for money they earned after years of honest labor. Some people can buy all material they want for money they got from their affluent parents working in offices mostly doing no good. And yet other people cannot buy it, because they cannot afford it, so they download it free of charge and it doesn't hurt anyone. I don't see how this group is any worse than those other groups, or any other you can think of, for that matter. If there is a book and someone wants to read it, or ditto watch a movie, why not? I cannot see the harm in that and I would suspect many artists would want the maximum spread of their creations, including people who would rather buy bread and beer if they were given the cash to buy the book/movie. You might have noticed how I shared my code without blinking. While I don't consider myself an "artist", I don't really see "art" anywhere: I see craft, and I am definitely a craftsman as much as any author writing a book. > ... including that tiny minority who strive to > improve the world through the creation of art ... In order for people to be creative, they must have access to creative material. Making material available in numerous forms boosts creativity. But not only indirectly: my w3m hacks are an example of creativity fueled by the piracy itself. This isn't unheard of: do you know of the ultra-creative C64 demo scene in Sweden and other countries in the 80s? All that marvelous work originated from the swapping business - the "sneakernet" as it sometimes is called today, long after. Google "Fairlight" and "Triad" - the most known groups - and tell me that isn't creative. With no money involved, and accessible to anyone, the whole demo scene a direct offspring of the crack intros to pirated games... If people had cared for the laws, would any of that happened? -- underground experts united