From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Pascal J. Bourguignon" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: making software with Emacs and Elisp Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2013 03:42:09 +0200 Organization: Informatimago Message-ID: <87fvrwiuq6.fsf@informatimago.com> References: <87ob6k23t3.fsf@nl106-137-194.student.uu.se> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1382232014 20375 80.91.229.3 (20 Oct 2013 01:20:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2013 01:20:14 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 20 03:20:20 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VXhgo-00089K-Tt for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 20 Oct 2013 03:20:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:34836 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VXhgo-0002pZ-AT for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Oct 2013 21:20:18 -0400 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 105 Original-X-Trace: individual.net OIK6fBVBByPnCCoK72wppwyOUee+ZbfAMm4JTlawdYqKyzwd3B Cancel-Lock: sha1:NTYwMzFjYzdhOWI4ZTk0OTQ4OGNjNWFhYTdiNTVjODc5YTVkYTc0YQ== sha1:K4VmXhNKq4MspYpcm2H25x6bL6U= Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAQMAAABtzGvEAAAABlBMVEUAAAD///+l2Z/dAAAA oElEQVR4nK3OsRHCMAwF0O8YQufUNIQRGIAja9CxSA55AxZgFO4coMgYrEDDQZWPIlNAjwq9 033pbOBPtbXuB6PKNBn5gZkhGa86Z4x2wE67O+06WxGD/HCOGR0deY3f9Ijwwt7rNGNf6Oac l/GuZTF1wFGKiYYHKSFAkjIo1b6sCYS1sVmFhhhahKQssRjRT90ITWUk6vvK3RsPGs+M1RuR mV+hO/VvFAAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Accept-Language: fr, es, en User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3 (gnu/linux) Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:201837 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:94106 Archived-At: Emanuel Berg writes: > I have several ideas for software that has to do with > physical things, and does not belong in the world of > computing. For example, I'm working on a tool to teach > deaf people read lips! (Not "Lisp".) > > Is there a minimal binary Emacs VM for the accursed > Apple and Windows world, that you could distribute along > with the software, or is there another way you could > make all that work? There are binaries of emacs for MacOSX, MS-Windows and various unices including GNU systems. In general, an installation of emacs includes the emacs executable, plus a set of compiled emacs lisp libraries (.elc files in /usr/share/emacs/). Usually, there are also the source .el files. There are also a few auxiliary programs in /usr/lib/emacs (movemail, hexl, etc). On a 64-bit system: $ du -shc /usr/share/emacs/24.2/ /usr/lib/emacs/24.2/ /usr/bin/emacs24-x 69M /usr/share/emacs/24.2/ 96K /usr/lib/emacs/24.2/ 13M /usr/bin/emacs24-x 82M total The binary is only 13MB (about 8MB on a 32-bit system IIRC). You could prefectly use only that. You can try it with the -Q option: emacs -Q and see what's left of the emacs user experience with it. You could indeed develop an application on this bare emacs, but this would be equivalent to develop an application on a bare Linux kernel with only a shell and gcc installed. You can write an ed-like editor in bash, and soon enough be editing programs to be compiled with gcc. Perhaps the first program you'd write would be a lisp interpreter in which to write an emacs… But soon after that, you'll gather libraries to be able to write higher level programs. To compare with little applications in the accursed Apple world: 428M NeoOffice.app 346M iWeb.app 225M iTunes.app 177M iPhoto.app 176M GarageBand.app 158M XBMC.app 141M Coqide.app 139M VLC.app 139M Second Life Viewer 2.app 136M DXOOpticsPro8.app 133M Emacs.app 126M Aquamacs.app 123M iDVD.app 121M Wireshark.app 115M iMovie.app 103M Firefox.app --------------------------------> emacs 24.2 with everything 67M SeaMonkey.app 64M Skype.app 56M Camino.app 54M Mail.app 53M VLCStreamer.app 53M Firefox3.app 52M Coda.app 51M Thunderbird.app 48M SuperTrainsFree.app 45M Dropbox.app 43M Preview.app 38M iCal.app 36M Clozure CL.app 31M Safari.app 31M QuickTime Player.app 30M iChat.app 22M Photo Booth.app 21M Address Book.app 20M Plane Control Lite.app 18M ArgoUML.app 16M DivX Player.app ------------------------------> /usr/bin/emacs24-x 13M FaceTime.app 12M Nokia Multimedia Transfer.app 11M Font Book.app 10M DVD Player.app 10M Automator.app 10M App Store.app So I don't see what you would earn, in preventing yourself to use the *.elc libraries provided with emacs in your emacs application. Unless you like to fight with both hands tied in the back. -- __Pascal Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/