From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: RFC: Flavors - naming significant sets of customizations Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2013 02:05:48 +0100 Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server Message-ID: <87eh5yitq2.fsf@nl106-137-194.student.uu.se> References: <9fc6b1ae-7cbd-4a17-a9a0-f4af42969312@googlegroups.com> <5592550c-72f1-4e9b-93db-dc7f95742d27@googlegroups.com> <874n6vx2aq.fsf@nl106-137-194.student.uu.se> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1385773825 31286 80.91.229.3 (30 Nov 2013 01:10:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2013 01:10:25 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 30 02:10:32 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VmZ4o-0002KJ-HZ for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Nov 2013 02:10:30 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50536 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VmZ4o-0005BL-2C for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 20:10:30 -0500 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!news.kjsl.com!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!news.stack.nl!aioe.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 67 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: VVbyYd/iFZoeWNmD9i++cQ.user.speranza.aioe.org Original-X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.4 (gnu/linux) X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2 Cancel-Lock: sha1:41/PgvekXqRStzq3D4CJnNftwPI= Mail-Copies-To: never Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:202466 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:94735 Archived-At: Rustom Mody writes: >> I still don't understand what a "large >> customization" is, or is supposed to be. > > Standard (and contentious) example: cua. > > Current cua-mode is a hack. If someone wants cua > *keybindings* with standard emacs *functionality* he is > out of luck because this requires deep surgery on all > modes -- moving out C-x and C-c to some other keys. So what are you saying, someone would perform that deep surgery (to get a non-hack cua), and this would be an Emacs "suite"? That doesn't really synch with those examples Jambunathan K provided. Those actually sound exactly like the Linux distros: repackage the same thing (over and over again) based on the different behaviour of the (segmented) user base. Let me give you an actual example, and you tell me if this is a good idea. In the current issue of "Linux Magazine" (a magazine that, by the way, dropped their entire "letters" section the moment I started writing to them), anyway in that issue there is a review of the latest "new" Linux distro: openArtist. openArtist is based on Ubuntu. (They didn't mention that Ubuntu, in turn, is a Debian derivative.) The reviewer noted the following. * openArtist uses GNOME 3 as the desktop suite, only, it is in the "GNOME 2 mode". * The desktop has a black-and-gray color theme. (!) * Contrary to the Ubuntu philosophy (one tool per area of computer activity), openArtist provides lots of tools for various purposes within the artistic field. And so the reviewer notes: as there are so many tools provided, openArtist is probably most likely to attract "advanced users". I mean: Completely and utterly *outrageous*! I whole f-ing distro just to make GNOME 3 look like GNOME 2, to set the background to black, and to install various tools - installing, a *one-liner* with aptitude! And after that, they dare say this is something for "advanced users"! And then just think of all the superstructure work that has to be done managing a distro - homepage, mailing lists, policy decisions, etc. etc. (And if you think I'm exaggerating, just pick up the magazine at your local public library and read it for yourself.) Can anyone tell me why we should do this for Emacs? We should do *new* things (or *improve* things), and not rebrand, repackage, etc. what is already here! -- Emanuel Berg, programmer-for-rent. CV, projects, etc at uXu underground experts united: http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573