From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: IDE versus emacs Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2012 16:23:19 +0200 Message-ID: <87d30xatgo.fsf@wanadoo.es> References: <83d30y87yi.fsf@gnu.org> <83626q7zvk.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5jl243r.fsf@gmail.com> <87pq4xbqup.fsf@wanadoo.es> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1349447029 23999 80.91.229.3 (5 Oct 2012 14:23:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2012 14:23:49 +0000 (UTC) To: Wally Lepore , Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 05 16:23:51 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TK8og-0007ep-Cv for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 16:23:50 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:32818 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TK8oa-0002gQ-DL for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:23:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:56975) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TK8oM-0002dM-VF for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:23:39 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TK8oG-0006so-Uj for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:23:30 -0400 Original-Received: from impaqm4.telefonica.net ([213.4.138.20]:18393 helo=telefonica.net) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TK8oG-0006rO-Jf for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:23:24 -0400 Original-Received: from IMPmailhost6.adm.correo ([10.20.102.127]) by IMPaqm4.telefonica.net with bizsmtp id 7S1T1k0Nh2kvMAa3QSPMYk; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 16:23:21 +0200 Original-Received: from qcore ([83.34.29.161]) by IMPmailhost6.adm.correo with BIZ IMP id 7SPK1k00c3Ua4l71mSPLph; Fri, 05 Oct 2012 16:23:21 +0200 X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-original-sender: 981711563@telefonica.net In-Reply-To: (Wally Lepore's message of "Fri, 5 Oct 2012 09:45:18 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.1.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 213.4.138.20 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:87081 Archived-At: Wally Lepore writes: > On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 10:22 PM, =C3=93scar Fuentes wrot= e: >> >> Nor even on C/C++ Emacs is a top contender as an IDE anymore. >> > > Please clarify last sentence so I can better understand. Thank you > very much. Modern IDEs have a deep understanding of the programming language and this brings in very interesting features that are out of the reach of the simplistic syntactical parsing that Emacs does. One of the most evident examples is code completion. If you write foo. on one of those modern IDEs, the type of `foo' is often known and the candidates for completion that the IDE offers are restrained to the data members or methods of the class/struct that corresponds to `foo'. Those candidate methods are shown with signature and documentation. That alone is a huge productivity boost when you are working with a big API. Other related facilities are code browsing & navigation, refactoring, accurate source code filling and unobtrusive error reporting as you write code. Emacs has partial support for some of those features, with CEDET always shining on the horizon, but instead of catching up with other IDEs as time passes, it is falling behind. Then, on integrating with the traditional tools that comes with the IDE (debuggers, profilers, etc) Emacs still is on the 90s. The GDB interface looks primitive, flaky, arcane and inconvenient compared to other IDEs. Don't get me wrong. I love Emacs and don't plan to switch anytime soon, because Emacs is a great configurable *editor*. But I'll have a hard time justifying the use of Emacs for C# or Java projects. My C++ work does not suffer so much because I already know the APIs well enough, although whenever I write or browse some "advanced" C++ I have to struggle with CCMode auto-fill and font-locking capabilities. And, to show the whole picture, it is true that Emacs is the best IDE for quite a few languages. Those tend to be minority (but very interesting) languages without the backing of Big Money but with very devoted users that invest lots of time on improving Emacs' support for their pet language.