From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Phillip Lord Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: ange-ftp and sftp? Date: 13 Jun 2005 18:08:45 +0100 Organization: School of Computer Science, University of Manchester, U.K. Message-ID: <877jgyxjz6.fsf@rpc71.cs.man.ac.uk> References: <87u0kblbau.fsf@rpc71.cs.man.ac.uk> <87ll5e36jc.fsf@rpc71.cs.man.ac.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1118686277 5886 80.91.229.2 (13 Jun 2005 18:11:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:11:17 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jun 13 20:11:17 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DhtOi-0002Ai-17 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:10:56 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DhtTY-000150-BC for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:15:56 -0400 Original-Path: shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!colt.net!news.nl.colt.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsfeed.bit.nl!news2.euro.net!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!130.88.203.18.MISMATCH!peernews.mcc.ac.uk!cs.man.ac.uk!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 35 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: rpc71.cs.man.ac.uk Original-X-Trace: wapping.cs.man.ac.uk 1118682526 10030 130.88.198.228 (13 Jun 2005 17:08:46 GMT) Original-X-Complaints-To: news@wapping.cs.man.ac.uk Original-NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:08:46 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 Original-Xref: shelby.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:131982 Original-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:27452 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help:27452 >>>>> "Miles" == Miles Bader writes: Miles> In my experience it can take tramp up to 30-40 seconds to Miles> open the first file on a remote machine, even over a local Miles> network! Ange-ftp isn't great either, but it's faster than Miles> that (especially once the connection is established). I Miles> expect sftp would be even faster if made to work. >> I'm guessing that tramp tries to abstract over the different >> transport mechanisms, and so can't use their features as much? Miles> Not really -- tramp is written for a very specific method of Miles> operation: it uses a user login session on the remote Miles> machine, doing all communication over the standard input and Miles> ouput channel for that login. I think it's common to have Miles> remote login capabilities even when FTP doesn't work, so Miles> tramp might be more widely usable. Presumably this is only true for inline methods? Things like the scp method can't assume login capability. Miles> Tramp tries to make few assumptions about the availability of Miles> various programs on the remote machine, and doesn't assume a Miles> clear communications channel, so it is forced to use some Miles> very clunky and slow methods (for instance, it actually Miles> downloads various scripts to the remote machine when it first Miles> connects, and always encodes files for transfer using a Miles> conservative safe encoding). Ah. Yes, you were right in your first post. I really didn't want to know that as it is, officially, too scary. Phil