[FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Thorsten Jolitz]

Hi List, 

Emacs success as an editor or rather an OS is sometimes explained by
its (at least superficial) similaritiy to a LispMachine [fn:1]:

,----
| Emacs as a LispMachine
| 
| Some people have started to refer to Emacs as a LispMachine. It is
| not strictly a LispMachine because, clearly, it is a software
| program and not a physical computer, but as that line starts to blur
| it seems like a useful epithet for Emacs because these days Emacs
| look more and more like an operating system.
`----

Today a modern 64bit LispMachine, based on one of the most exciting Lisp
dialects around, has been announced [fn:2]:

,----
| PilMCU is an implementation of 64-bit PicoLisp directly in hardware. A
| truly minimalistic system. PicoLisp is both the machine language and the
| operating system:
| 
|    * Memory management is trivial, just the Lisp heap and the stack
|    * The built-in database is extended to hold a "file system"
|    * One SSD per database file for mass storage
|    * "Processes" run as tasks and coroutines
|    * Events (timing and interrupts) via a 'wait' instruction
|    * Complex I/O protocols are delegated to peripheral chips
| 
| The final hardware can be very lightweight. Low transistor count and
| power consumption. No overhead for an OS. It is conceivable for a later
| stage to put many interconnected CPUs on a single chip.
| 
| At present, we have it running in the Verilog simulator, and in an
| emulator (adaption of the PicoLisp 'emu' architecture). [...]
| 
| We imagine something in the line of an "Embedded Lisp Machine" or a
| "Lisp Machine Kit". Perhaps for home brewing, educational institutions
| and/or robotics research?
`----

I thought this might be interesting for Emacs hackers and user too.

* Footnotes

[fn:1] http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/LispMachine

[fn:2] http://www.mail-archive.com/picolisp@software-lab.de/msg04823.html


-- 
cheers,
Thorsten

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Grant Rettke]

Wonderful!
Grant Rettke
gcr@wisdomandwonder.com | http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/
“Wisdom begins in wonder.” --Socrates
((λ (x) (x x)) (λ (x) (x x)))
“Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop
taking it seriously.” --Thompson


On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 12:20 PM, Thorsten Jolitz <tjolitz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi List,
>
> Emacs success as an editor or rather an OS is sometimes explained by
> its (at least superficial) similaritiy to a LispMachine [fn:1]:
>
> ,----
> | Emacs as a LispMachine
> |
> | Some people have started to refer to Emacs as a LispMachine. It is
> | not strictly a LispMachine because, clearly, it is a software
> | program and not a physical computer, but as that line starts to blur
> | it seems like a useful epithet for Emacs because these days Emacs
> | look more and more like an operating system.
> `----
>
> Today a modern 64bit LispMachine, based on one of the most exciting Lisp
> dialects around, has been announced [fn:2]:
>
> ,----
> | PilMCU is an implementation of 64-bit PicoLisp directly in hardware. A
> | truly minimalistic system. PicoLisp is both the machine language and the
> | operating system:
> |
> |    * Memory management is trivial, just the Lisp heap and the stack
> |    * The built-in database is extended to hold a "file system"
> |    * One SSD per database file for mass storage
> |    * "Processes" run as tasks and coroutines
> |    * Events (timing and interrupts) via a 'wait' instruction
> |    * Complex I/O protocols are delegated to peripheral chips
> |
> | The final hardware can be very lightweight. Low transistor count and
> | power consumption. No overhead for an OS. It is conceivable for a later
> | stage to put many interconnected CPUs on a single chip.
> |
> | At present, we have it running in the Verilog simulator, and in an
> | emulator (adaption of the PicoLisp 'emu' architecture). [...]
> |
> | We imagine something in the line of an "Embedded Lisp Machine" or a
> | "Lisp Machine Kit". Perhaps for home brewing, educational institutions
> | and/or robotics research?
> `----
>
> I thought this might be interesting for Emacs hackers and user too.
>
> * Footnotes
>
> [fn:1] http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/LispMachine
>
> [fn:2] http://www.mail-archive.com/picolisp@software-lab.de/msg04823.html
>
>
> --
> cheers,
> Thorsten
>
>

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Emanuel Berg]

Grant Rettke <gcr@wisdomandwonder.com> writes:

> Wonderful! Grant Rettke gcr@wisdomandwonder.com |
> http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/ “Wisdom begins in
> wonder.” --Socrates ((λ (x) (x x)) (λ (x) (x x)))
> “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been
> forced to stop taking it seriously.” --Thompson

Off topic: It is a good idea to put your signature
below two dashes (--) - that way clients can be
configured to hide them (and show them on RET) as in
Gnus with (gnus-article-hide-signature nil 1) - which
doesn't work for your signature because of the lack of
dashes. Especially since you write so short messages
and have such a long signature, I'd really recommend
it.

If you like, read RFC 3676:

    There is a long-standing convention in Usenet news
    which also commonly appears in Internet mail of
    using "-- " as the separator line between the body
    and the signature of a message. ...

Full document: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3676.txt
    
-- 
underground experts united

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Chris F.A. Johnson]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: TEXT/PLAIN, Size: 1293 bytes --]

On Sun, 21 Sep 2014, Emanuel Berg wrote:

> Grant Rettke <gcr@wisdomandwonder.com> writes:
>
>> Wonderful! Grant Rettke gcr@wisdomandwonder.com |
>> http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/ “Wisdom begins in
>> wonder.” --Socrates ((λ (x) (x x)) (λ (x) (x x)))
>> “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been
>> forced to stop taking it seriously.” --Thompson
>
> Off topic: It is a good idea to put your signature
> below two dashes (--) - that way clients can be

    As the passage from RFC 3676 says, that should be two dashes and a
    space, '-- '. Two dashes alone don't do anything in most news/mail
    agents.

> configured to hide them (and show them on RET) as in
> Gnus with (gnus-article-hide-signature nil 1) - which
> doesn't work for your signature because of the lack of
> dashes. Especially since you write so short messages
> and have such a long signature, I'd really recommend
> it.
>
> If you like, read RFC 3676:
>
>    There is a long-standing convention in Usenet news
>    which also commonly appears in Internet mail of
>    using "-- " as the separator line between the body
>    and the signature of a message. ...
>
> Full document: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3676.txt

-- 
Chris F.A. Johnson, <http://cfajohnson.com>

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Emanuel Berg]

"Chris F.A. Johnson" <chris@cfajohnson.com> writes:

> As the passage from RFC 3676 says, that should be two
> dashes and a space, '-- '. Two dashes alone don't do
> anything in most news/mail agents.

After running some tests, I can confirm that it should
be two dashes at the beginning of the line, then space,
then newline, then the signature. (It is actually
possible to have an empty signature but then the marker
to indicate the start of the signature doesn't make any
sense.)

In all other cases, at least with Gnus, it doesn't
work: e.g., a space before the first dash, or a char
after the space, or the signature being on the same
line (i.e., that coincides with the previous fail
case).

-- 
underground experts united

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Emanuel Berg]

Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se> writes:

>> As the passage from RFC 3676 says, that should be
>> two dashes and a space, '-- '. Two dashes alone
>> don't do anything in most news/mail agents.
>
> After running some tests, I can confirm that it
> should be two dashes at the beginning of the line,
> then space, then newline, then the signature. (It is
> actually possible to have an empty signature but then
> the marker to indicate the start of the signature
> doesn't make any sense.)
>
> In all other cases, at least with Gnus, it doesn't
> work: e.g., a space before the first dash, or a char
> after the space, or the signature being on the same
> line (i.e., that coincides with the previous fail
> case).

I forgot one test: beginning of line, double dash,
newline (i.e., no space), signature. In Gnus, that
works as well. But, with `gnus-posting-styles', if
instructed to add a signature, as in (signature "the
signature"), then it nevertheless uses the correct
'-- '.

-- 
underground experts united

Re: [FYI] The Lisp Machine is back

[Grant Rettke]

On Sat, Sep 20, 2014 at 8:55 PM, Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se> wrote:
> Off topic: It is a good idea to put your signature
> below two dashes (--) - that way clients can be
> configured to hide them (and show them on RET) as in
> Gnus with (gnus-article-hide-signature nil 1) - which
> doesn't work for your signature because of the lack of
> dashes.

Thank you for sharing that in a concise and pleasant manner.

Correction made. The delimiter should now be in place.

-- 
Grant Rettke
gcr@wisdomandwonder.com | http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/
“Wisdom begins in wonder.” --Socrates
((λ (x) (x x)) (λ (x) (x x)))
“Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop
taking it seriously.” --Thompson