From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Robert Thorpe Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: not good proposal: "C-z " reserved for users Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2021 08:17:09 +0000 Message-ID: <871rdk4c1m.fsf@robertthorpeconsulting.com> References: <0e37cf97-b9ee-e3af-16e3-3a312c47e75f@yandex.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="25864"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: gregory@heytings.org, help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 13 09:18:19 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lAq8B-0006cO-Gr for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 09:18:19 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:32930 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAq8A-0002Fo-In for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 03:18:18 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59278) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAq7h-0002FV-05 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 03:17:49 -0500 Original-Received: from outbound-smtp13.blacknight.com ([46.22.139.230]:39569) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAq7d-0007VT-N2 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 03:17:48 -0500 Original-Received: from mail.blacknight.com (pemlinmail06.blacknight.ie [81.17.255.152]) by outbound-smtp13.blacknight.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22C911C457A for ; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 08:17:42 +0000 (GMT) Original-Received: (qmail 32501 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2021 08:17:41 -0000 Original-Received: from unknown (HELO rt-inspiron-3480) (rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com@[109.76.74.4]) by 81.17.254.9 with ESMTPSA (AES256-SHA encrypted, authenticated); 13 Feb 2021 08:17:41 -0000 In-Reply-To: <0e37cf97-b9ee-e3af-16e3-3a312c47e75f@yandex.ru> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Fri, 12 Feb 2021 14:40:38 +0200) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=46.22.139.230; envelope-from=rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com; helo=outbound-smtp13.blacknight.com X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:127912 Archived-At: Dmitry Gutov writes: > On 12.02.2021 07:42, Robert Thorpe wrote: > >> I agree with Jean Louis on that too. I think C-z C-z is not good >> enough. Every other terminal application uses C-z by itself, it's a >> convention. It's been that way for decades. If you write a terminal >> application and do nothing special then C-z will suspend it. That's >> because it sends SIGTSTP. > > Could we someday stop considering Emacs a "terminal application"? Yes, > it has a version that works in the terminal, but it's limited in > features compared to the graphical one. I only use graphical Emacs myself. But I think that terminal Emacs is still important, as Jean Louis says. Lots of people who have started using Emacs recently came to from the terminal. You can see that on Emacs Reddit. I'm not a web developer myself, but it seems to have happened like this.... Web people put their stuff on test servers to try it out. Sometimes they prepare it or compile it on their own PC then copy it to the test server. To save time some people started developing on the test server using things like VNC or Microsoft Remote Desktop. That removes the copying over step. Other would do tweaks to the code on the server by direct editing on the server, but keep the main code on their own PC. All that worked until web services became popular. Then the test server was no longer a nearby, dedicated server accessed by a fast network. It was an instance on a virtualized machine far away. That has made using graphical tools to access these test servers less practical. So, some people have moved to terminal programs instead. A terminal editor like Emacs is very useful for making quick changes on a remote virtual machine. That seems to have brought Emacs to a new audience. BR, Robert Thorpe