Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Hello Gnus

Now and then I see that people referencing posts from mailing lists.  Is
there a key in Gnus to do this?  It seems I'm lacking the necessary
keywords to find something relevant in DuckDuckGo or in the Gnus Info
manual..

Thanks

        Dieter

-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Byung-Hee HWANG]

Hellow Dieter,

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> Hello Gnus
>
> Now and then I see that people referencing posts from mailing lists.  Is
> there a key in Gnus to do this?  It seems I'm lacking the necessary
> keywords to find something relevant in DuckDuckGo or in the Gnus Info
> manual..

Reading is in Gmane, sending(replying) is to mailing list.

OK man, this is my story.

Usually, i read the messages in Gmane [gmane.emacs.help]. Then the
followup is to mailing address [help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org].

That's all.

Sincerely, Gnus fan Byung-Hee

-- 
^고맙습니다 _救濟蒼生_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Byung-Hee HWANG <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> writes:

> Hellow Dieter,
>
> "H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:
>
>> Hello Gnus
>>
>> Now and then I see that people referencing posts from mailing lists.  Is
>> there a key in Gnus to do this?  It seems I'm lacking the necessary
>> keywords to find something relevant in DuckDuckGo or in the Gnus Info
>> manual..
>
> Reading is in Gmane, sending(replying) is to mailing list.
>
> OK man, this is my story.
>
> Usually, i read the messages in Gmane [gmane.emacs.help]. Then the
> followup is to mailing address [help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org].

That is what we are doing right now, don't we? :-)

But when I would like to refer to a post in another threat? And I would
like you to be able to read (or at least find) this article as well.
How to do that?

    Dieter
-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Byung-Hee HWANG]

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> ...
> But when I would like to refer to a post in another threat? And I would
> like you to be able to read (or at least find) this article as well.
> How to do that?

Ah i read wrong your question. Maybe it is about Gmane things, i
think. You would like see some web link such as:
<http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help/134853>
<http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.video.ffmpeg.devel/84145>

But now it is impossible.
See <https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/category/gmane/>

Sincerely, Gnus fan Byung-Hee

-- 
^고맙습니다 _和合團結_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Byung-Hee HWANG]

> Ah i read wrong your question. Maybe it is ...

Oh still i read wrong again... actually i should have to study more
English with careful! Though i love Gnus and the peoples... ^^^

Sincerely, Gnus fan Byung-Hee

-- 
^고맙습니다 _布德天下_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Kévin Le Gouguec]

Hi Dieter,

Assuming the "references" you're interested in are message IDs,

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> But when I would like to refer to a post in another threat? 

While reading a post (or "article" in Gnusspeak) in the summary buffer,
you can hit "C-u g" to see the raw message; somewhere in there you'll
see this header:

> Message-ID: <86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof-wilhelm.de>

Not sure if Gnus has a keybinding to copy them without going through
"C-u g"; FWIW I've written this small helper:

(defun my/kill-message-id ()
  (interactive)
  (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))

I haven't tried it, but you could probably also add "^Message-Id:" to
gnus-visible-headers.

Last option that I know of: if you're looking at the mailing list's web
archives, e.g. here:

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00103.html

You'll see a comment in the HTML source with this same message ID:

> <!--X-Message-Id: 86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof&#45;wilhelm.de -->

>                                                             And I would
> like you to be able to read (or at least find) this article as well.
> How to do that?

Two ways that I know of:

- Gnus adds buttons on top of message IDs, so either clicking those or
  TAB'ing your way to them and hitting RET will fetch the corresponding
  article,

- "j" in the summary buffer will prompt for a message ID and fetch it.


Hope that helps.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Kévin Le Gouguec wrote:

> Last option that I know of: if you're looking at the mailing
> list's web archives, e.g. here:
>
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00103.html

That's the only option, rather ... but is there no a way of
getting that URL from the message. Bring up Byung-Hee's
message and search for "103" in the headers ... not there.

I think the piece of code or software that sends the mails
could be synched with the archive so that URL would be
included in a header tho ... that would solve this issue in
the best possible way.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Kévin Le Gouguec]

Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
<help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> writes:

> That's the only option, rather ... but is there no a way of
> getting that URL from the message.

Knowing a message ID, you should be able to search for it in the
archive, e.g.

1. Go to https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/
2. Paste in "+message-id:877dg24k6z.fsf@zoho.eu"
3. This brings up this single result:

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-08/msg00599.html

Doesn't seem to be working for recent-ish messages though.  Don't know
if there's something wrong with Namazu, MHonArc, or if it just takes
time for messages to be indexed 🤷

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Kévin Le Gouguec wrote:

>> That's the only option, rather ... but is there no a way of
>> getting that URL from the message.
>
> Knowing a message ID, you should be able to search for it in the
> archive, e.g.
>
> 1. Go to https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/
> 2. Paste in "+message-id:877dg24k6z.fsf@zoho.eu"
> 3. This brings up this single result:
>
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-08/msg00599.html

Okay ... still not so good. An (that) URL in the message would
be better.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Hello Kévin

Kévin Le Gouguec <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com> writes:

> Assuming the "references" you're interested in are message IDs,

Actually I thought originally on some "link" functionality, but in a
wider sense, anything which makes a post unique.

> "H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:
>
>> But when I would like to refer to a post in another threat? 
>
> While reading a post (or "article" in Gnusspeak) in the summary buffer,
> you can hit "C-u g" to see the raw message; somewhere in there you'll
> see this header:
>
>> Message-ID: <86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof-wilhelm.de>

I see, checking some arbitrary post's message ID from emacs-devel:

Message-ID: <87a6hc9kge.fsf@telefonica.net>

But I can't activate or clicking it in message mode, at least in the
*unsent wide reply...* buffer.

> Not sure if Gnus has a keybinding to copy them without going through
> "C-u g"; FWIW I've written this small helper:
>
 (defun my/kill-message-id ()
   (interactive)
   (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))

<871r2ofls5.fsf@gmail.com> (for the current one)

Thanks, it seems to work (though the cursor is skipping to the end of
the message ;-)).

> I haven't tried it, but you could probably also add "^Message-Id:" to
> gnus-visible-headers.

Thanks, it's working for me. :-)

> Last option that I know of: if you're looking at the mailing list's web
> archives, e.g. here:
>
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00103.html

Thank you for the pointer to the archive!  Is the GNU organisation
itself maintaining such archives?

> You'll see a comment in the HTML source with this same message ID:
>
>> <!--X-Message-Id: 86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof&#45;wilhelm.de -->

I see, but how did you find this article?  I tried to search (for parts)
of the message ID and this seems not to work.  If I want to use html
links for such archives I need to search, for example, for the time of
the post or the author to get to a particular message in the web
archive, right?

>>                                                             And I would
>> like you to be able to read (or at least find) this article as well.
>> How to do that?
>
> Two ways that I know of:
>
> - Gnus adds buttons on top of message IDs, so either clicking those or
>   TAB'ing your way to them and hitting RET will fetch the corresponding
>   article,

OK, I should be able to check this, after having send this message. :-)

> - "j" in the summary buffer will prompt for a message ID and fetch it.

yes "j" works, how nice.  So, actually, I don't need to search in an
html archive for a link, I just have to paste the respective message ID
of a post I want to reference to, great!

Oh wait!  What about Gmail or other mail readers of Emacs, do they have
this functionality as well?

> Hope that helps.

Well, at a first read, your messages only confused me.  But now it seems
that you gave me already more than I was asking for! :-)

Thank you very much.

    Dieter


-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:

>> Not sure if Gnus has a keybinding to copy them without
>> going through "C-u g"; FWIW I've written this small helper:
>
>  (defun my/kill-message-id ()
>    (interactive)
>    (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>
> <871r2ofls5.fsf@gmail.com> (for the current one)
>
> Thanks, it seems to work (though the cursor is skipping to
> the end of the message ;-))

Uhm ... works?

One would need a URL to the message in the archive, in this
case

  https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00117.html

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
<help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> writes:

> H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:
>
>>> Not sure if Gnus has a keybinding to copy them without
>>> going through "C-u g"; FWIW I've written this small helper:
>>
>>  (defun my/kill-message-id ()
>>    (interactive)
>>    (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>>
>> <871r2ofls5.fsf@gmail.com> (for the current one)
>>
>> Thanks, it seems to work (though the cursor is skipping to
>> the end of the message ;-))
>
> Uhm ... works?

Yes, when I'm in the *Summary ...* buffer it saves the respective
message ID (below for your message).

<87lf0wynln.fsf@zoho.eu>

> One would need a URL to the message in the archive, in this
> case
>
>   https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00117.html

Sorry, I don't understand your argument here.  The function revolves
about message IDs and not the links to a list archive.  (Which might be
more helpful in general, though. :-))

  Dieter

-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Michael Heerdegen]

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> >> Message-ID: <86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof-wilhelm.de>
>
> I see, checking some arbitrary post's message ID from emacs-devel:
>
> Message-ID: <87a6hc9kge.fsf@telefonica.net>
>
> But I can't activate or clicking it in message mode, at least in the
> *unsent wide reply...* buffer.

Not in message-mode - but I could click them when reading your message.

AFAIU Gnus silently makes such things to buttons when you read an
article containing such a thing (i.e. plain text, as you just posted).
If I understand correctly, `gnus-article-highlight' and
`gnus-button-alist' are responsible.

I dunno if and how other mail user agents handle such message refs.

Are you happy with what you see when you open your own message (the one
I am responding to now)?


Grüße zum Dünenhof,

Michael.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Michael Heerdegen wrote:

> I dunno if and how other mail user agents handle such
> message refs.

Indeed ...

(MUA = e-mail client)

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> writes:

> "H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:
>
>> >> Message-ID: <86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof-wilhelm.de>
>>
>> I see, checking some arbitrary post's message ID from emacs-devel:
>>
>> Message-ID: <87a6hc9kge.fsf@telefonica.net>
>>
>> But I can't activate or clicking it in message mode, at least in the
>> *unsent wide reply...* buffer.
>
> Not in message-mode - but I could click them when reading your message.

Right, I checked this for above "Message-ID link". :-)

But did you notice as well that this message from emacs-devel is then
shown in the help-gnu-emacs summary buffer!?  

> I dunno if and how other mail user agents handle such message refs.

So for the sake of all non Gnuses it would be better to send html
links...

> Are you happy with what you see when you open your own message (the one
> I am responding to now)?

Yes indeed!  Thank you.

> Grüße zum Dünenhof,

:-) Kind greetings back

       Dieter
-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Michael Heerdegen]

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> But did you notice as well that this message from emacs-devel is then
> shown in the help-gnu-emacs summary buffer!?

Buffer, or window?

For me it appears in the window that displayed the original article
(containing the link).  May depend on your config.  At the end, as far
as I can see, the "link" is opened with `gnus-summary-display-article'.
Seems you can change the behavior by setting
`gnus-summary-display-article-function', the default behavior uses
`gnus-article-prepare'.  I would expect that this should behave the same
as selecting an article from the summary ordinarily.

Michael.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Michael Heerdegen]

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> But did you notice as well that this message from emacs-devel is then
> shown in the help-gnu-emacs summary buffer!?

Please ignore my last mail, I see now that I misunderstood what you
meant.  Yes, I see that, too.  Can be very convenient or very confusing.
I guess it is intended, it seems useful to me.

Michael.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Michael Heerdegen]

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de> writes:

> Please ignore my last mail, I see now that I misunderstood what you
> meant.  Yes, I see that, too.  Can be very convenient or very confusing.
> I guess it is intended, it seems useful to me.

BTW, the same happens when you use the registry, and you call
`gnus-summary-refer-parent-article': When the parent article is not in
the current summary buffer but can be retrieved using the registry it is
added to the summary buffer even if it isn't in the associated group.

Michael.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Kévin Le Gouguec]

"H. Dieter Wilhelm" <dieter@duenenhof-wilhelm.de> writes:

> Thanks, it seems to work (though the cursor is skipping to the end of
> the message ;-)).

Right; I should probably wrap this in a save-excursion form?

>> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2021-12/msg00103.html
>
> Thank you for the pointer to the archive!  Is the GNU organisation
> itself maintaining such archives?

AFAIK, yes.

Note that some GNU projects host additional mirrors of their discussions
on other archiving systems.  Notably, the Org Mode project uses
public-inbox:

https://list.orgmode.org/

FWIW I find public-inbox quite convenient for Message-ID users, since
the IDs are included in the URLs.

>> You'll see a comment in the HTML source with this same message ID:
>>
>>> <!--X-Message-Id: 86sfv76rqq.fsf@duenenhof&#45;wilhelm.de -->
>
> I see, but how did you find this article?  I tried to search (for parts)
> of the message ID and this seems not to work.  If I want to use html
> links for such archives I need to search, for example, for the time of
> the post or the author to get to a particular message in the web
> archive, right?

See my reply to Emanuel <877dcihgag.fsf@gmail.com>; it used to be that
you could query the archive for a message ID, e.g. go here:

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/

Then type in this search string:

+message-id:<6214117000e144ffaeceded74c239fb8@frb.gov>

That shold yield a single result (from a message I picked at random in
Gnus's summray buffer).

For some reason though, the search engine does not seem to work for more
recent messages.  Maybe indexing is broken?  Someone would need to ping
the list admins.

> Oh wait!  What about Gmail or other mail readers of Emacs, do they have
> this functionality as well?

Can't tell you 😕 I'd be very (though pleasantly) surprised if GMail
could work with Message IDs; as for other mail readers, I just don't
know.

For this reason I wrote some (very dumb and hackish, and just plain not
working ATM, don't know why) helpers, which take in either a message ID
(resp. an archive URL), fetch the corresponding URL (resp. message ID),
and format them like so:

> <ID>
> https://<URL>

… to provide convenient links for everyone, regardless of their mail
client.  As I said though, for some reason they don't work anymore; I'd
need to debug them 😒

#+begin_src elisp
;; Utilities for mailing lists.
(defun my/kill-message-id ()
  (interactive)
  (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))

(defun my/describe-message (id url)
  (kill-new (format "%s\n%s\n"
                    (if (string-prefix-p "<" id)
                        id
                      (format "<%s>" id))
                    url)))

(defun my/describe-message-id (list id)
  "Format references from the Message-ID of a gnu.org list."
  (interactive
   (list
    (read-string "List: ")            ; TODO: default to current list.
    (let ((default-id
            (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
      (read-string (format-prompt "Message-ID" default-id)
                   nil nil default-id))))
  (with-current-buffer
      (url-retrieve-synchronously
       (concat
        ;; For some reason, literal "+" chars cause the search to fail.
        ;; Escape them.
        "https://lists.gnu.org/archive/cgi-bin/namazu.cgi"
        "?query=%2Bmessage-id:"
        (replace-regexp-in-string "\\+" "%2B" id)
        "&submit=Search!"
        "&idxname=" list))
    (search-forward-regexp
     (rx "<a href=\""
         (group "/archive/html/" (literal list) "/"
                (+ (any "0-9-")) "/msg" (+ (any "0-9")) ".html")
         "\">"))
    (let ((url (concat "https://lists.gnu.org" (match-string 1))))
      (my/describe-message id url))))

(defun my/describe-message-url (url)
  "Format references from an article archived on MHonArc."
  (interactive
   (list
    (let ((default (or (thing-at-point 'url)
                       (and (derived-mode-p 'eww-mode)
                            (shr-url-at-point nil)))))
      (read-string (format-prompt "URL" default) nil nil default))))
  (with-current-buffer (url-retrieve-synchronously url)
    (search-forward-regexp "^<!--X-Message-Id: \\(.+\\) -->$")
    (let ((id (xml-substitute-numeric-entities (match-string 1))))
      (my/describe-message id url))))
#+end_src

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

Kévin Le Gouguec wrote:

> See my reply to Emanuel <877dcihgag.fsf@gmail.com>

Haha ... stop it :)

> it used to be that you could query the archive for a message
> ID, e.g. go here:
>
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/
>
> Then type in this search string:
>
> +message-id:<6214117000e144ffaeceded74c239fb8@frb.gov>
>
> That shold yield a single result (from a message I picked at
> random in Gnus's summray buffer).
>
> For some reason though, the search engine does not seem to
> work for more recent messages. Maybe indexing is broken?
> Someone would need to ping the list admins.

Better ask them for a header to the future archive post ...
they should have it.

re: your Elisp ... it's very good!

Just add this ...

  (require 'gnus-sum)
  (require 'nnheader)
  (require 'shr)
  (require 'xml)

and LIST, ID, and URL to the docstrings and you're all set :)

> #+begin_src elisp
> ;; Utilities for mailing lists.
> (defun my/kill-message-id ()
>   (interactive)
>   (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>
> (defun my/describe-message (id url)
>   (kill-new (format "%s\n%s\n"
>                     (if (string-prefix-p "<" id)
>                         id
>                       (format "<%s>" id))
>                     url)))
>
> (defun my/describe-message-id (list id)
>   "Format references from the Message-ID of a gnu.org list."
>   (interactive
>    (list
>     (read-string "List: ")            ; TODO: default to current list.
>     (let ((default-id
>             (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>       (read-string (format-prompt "Message-ID" default-id)
>                    nil nil default-id))))
>   (with-current-buffer
>       (url-retrieve-synchronously
>        (concat
>         ;; For some reason, literal "+" chars cause the search to fail.
>         ;; Escape them.
>         "https://lists.gnu.org/archive/cgi-bin/namazu.cgi"
>         "?query=%2Bmessage-id:"
>         (replace-regexp-in-string "\\+" "%2B" id)
>         "&submit=Search!"
>         "&idxname=" list))
>     (search-forward-regexp
>      (rx "<a href=\""
>          (group "/archive/html/" (literal list) "/"
>                 (+ (any "0-9-")) "/msg" (+ (any "0-9")) ".html")
>          "\">"))
>     (let ((url (concat "https://lists.gnu.org" (match-string 1))))
>       (my/describe-message id url))))
>
> (defun my/describe-message-url (url)
>   "Format references from an article archived on MHonArc."
>   (interactive
>    (list
>     (let ((default (or (thing-at-point 'url)
>                        (and (derived-mode-p 'eww-mode)
>                             (shr-url-at-point nil)))))
>       (read-string (format-prompt "URL" default) nil nil default))))
>   (with-current-buffer (url-retrieve-synchronously url)
>     (search-forward-regexp "^<!--X-Message-Id: \\(.+\\) -->$")
>     (let ((id (xml-substitute-numeric-entities (match-string 1))))
>       (my/describe-message id url))))
> #+end_src
>

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Kévin Le Gouguec <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com> writes:

> Then type in this search string:
>
> +message-id:<6214117000e144ffaeceded74c239fb8@frb.gov>

I didn't realise that one is able to do a dedicated search for these
IDs! Thanks a lot.

>> Oh wait!  What about Gmail or other mail readers of Emacs, do they have
>> this functionality as well?
>
> Can't tell you 😕 I'd be very (though pleasantly) surprised if GMail
> could work with Message IDs; as for other mail readers, I just don't
> know.

> … to provide convenient links for everyone, regardless of their mail
> client.  As I said though, for some reason they don't work anymore; I'd
> need to debug them 😒

> #+begin_src elisp
> ;; Utilities for mailing lists.
> (defun my/kill-message-id ()
>   (interactive)
>   (kill-new (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>
> (defun my/describe-message (id url)
>   (kill-new (format "%s\n%s\n"
>                     (if (string-prefix-p "<" id)
>                         id
>                       (format "<%s>" id))
>                     url)))
>
> (defun my/describe-message-id (list id)
>   "Format references from the Message-ID of a gnu.org list."
>   (interactive
>    (list
>     (read-string "List: ")            ; TODO: default to current list.
>     (let ((default-id
>             (mail-header-message-id (gnus-summary-article-header))))
>       (read-string (format-prompt "Message-ID" default-id)
>                    nil nil default-id))))
>   (with-current-buffer
>       (url-retrieve-synchronously
>        (concat
>         ;; For some reason, literal "+" chars cause the search to fail.
>         ;; Escape them.
>         "https://lists.gnu.org/archive/cgi-bin/namazu.cgi"
>         "?query=%2Bmessage-id:"
>         (replace-regexp-in-string "\\+" "%2B" id)
>         "&submit=Search!"
>         "&idxname=" list))
>     (search-forward-regexp
>      (rx "<a href=\""
>          (group "/archive/html/" (literal list) "/"
>                 (+ (any "0-9-")) "/msg" (+ (any "0-9")) ".html")
>          "\">"))
>     (let ((url (concat "https://lists.gnu.org" (match-string 1))))
>       (my/describe-message id url))))
>
> (defun my/describe-message-url (url)
>   "Format references from an article archived on MHonArc."
>   (interactive
>    (list
>     (let ((default (or (thing-at-point 'url)
>                        (and (derived-mode-p 'eww-mode)
>                             (shr-url-at-point nil)))))
>       (read-string (format-prompt "URL" default) nil nil default))))
>   (with-current-buffer (url-retrieve-synchronously url)
>     (search-forward-regexp "^<!--X-Message-Id: \\(.+\\) -->$")
>     (let ((id (xml-substitute-numeric-entities (match-string 1))))
>       (my/describe-message id url))))
> #+end_src

Interesting what people are able to do!  Thanks for the idea

            Dieter


-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Michael Heerdegen]

Kévin Le Gouguec <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com> writes:

>   (with-current-buffer
>       (url-retrieve-synchronously
>        (concat
>         ;; For some reason, literal "+" chars cause the search to fail.
>         ;; Escape them.
>         "https://lists.gnu.org/archive/cgi-bin/namazu.cgi"
>         "?query=%2Bmessage-id:"
>         (replace-regexp-in-string "\\+" "%2B" id)

AFAIK you can use `url-hexify-string' or `browse-url-url-encode-chars'
for this task.

Michael.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Yuri Khan]

On Wed, 8 Dec 2021 at 14:23, Kévin Le Gouguec <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Oh wait!  What about Gmail or other mail readers of Emacs, do they have
> > this functionality as well?
>
> Can't tell you 😕 I'd be very (though pleasantly) surprised if GMail
> could work with Message IDs; as for other mail readers, I just don't
> know.

Gmail can search by Message-ID, although the syntax is somewhat hard
to remember and it’s not exposed in the UI, you have to dig into help
to find it. The keyword is:

rfc822msgid:874k7j7e8u.fsf@gmail.com

On the other hand, forward lookup is straightforward: on a message,
clicking the ‘More’ menu and selecting ‘Show original’ opens the
message source form in a new tab, with the Message-ID right there on
the top, you don’t even have to scan the headers to look for it.


Thunderbird lets you search by any headers. You press Ctrl+Shift+F to
open the search dialog, then, in the ‘Match all of the following’
section, you have to pull down the field selector and, if Message-ID
is not there (by default), select Customize…, enter Message-ID and
click Add. This is a one-time setup, after that, it should be listed
in the pulldown.

To look up a message’s Message-ID header, you open its source (Ctrl+U)
and look for the header.

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Yuri Khan <yuri.v.khan@gmail.com> writes:

> On Wed, 8 Dec 2021 at 14:23, Kévin Le Gouguec <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> > Oh wait!  What about Gmail or other mail readers of Emacs, do they have
>> > this functionality as well?
>>
>> Can't tell you 😕 I'd be very (though pleasantly) surprised if GMail
>> could work with Message IDs; as for other mail readers, I just don't
>> know.
>
> Gmail can search by Message-ID, although the syntax is somewhat hard
> to remember and it’s not exposed in the UI, you have to dig into help
> to find it. The keyword is:
>
> rfc822msgid:874k7j7e8u.fsf@gmail.com
>
> On the other hand, forward lookup is straightforward: on a message,
> clicking the ‘More’ menu and selecting ‘Show original’ opens the
> message source form in a new tab, with the Message-ID right there on
> the top, you don’t even have to scan the headers to look for it.
>
>
> Thunderbird lets you search by any headers. You press Ctrl+Shift+F to
> open the search dialog, then, in the ‘Match all of the following’
> section, you have to pull down the field selector and, if Message-ID
> is not there (by default), select Customize…, enter Message-ID and
> click Add. This is a one-time setup, after that, it should be listed
> in the pulldown.
>
> To look up a message’s Message-ID header, you open its source (Ctrl+U)
> and look for the header.

I was about to resign to search the http links but now you showed that
showing a message IDs is also helpful for popular MUAs, maybe also for
Rmail?

Thanks a lot

       Dieter
-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:

> I was about to resign to search the http links but now you
> showed that showing a message IDs is also helpful for
> popular MUAs, maybe also for Rmail?

But it doesn't really matter ... I mean as
a technical-intellectual pursuit yes, but that's it.

Proper URLs are the only real way forward ...

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[H. Dieter Wilhelm]

Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor
<help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org> writes:

> H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:
>
>> I was about to resign to search the http links but now you
>> showed that showing a message IDs is also helpful for
>> popular MUAs, maybe also for Rmail?
>
> But it doesn't really matter ... I mean as
> a technical-intellectual pursuit yes, but that's it.
>
> Proper URLs are the only real way forward ...

I see, thanks for your opinon.  If I remember correctly most developers
are sending also html links...

           Dieter
-- 
Best wishes
H. Dieter Wilhelm
Zwingenberg, Germany

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:

>>> I was about to resign to search the http links but now you
>>> showed that showing a message IDs is also helpful for
>>> popular MUAs, maybe also for Rmail?
>>
>> But it doesn't really matter ... I mean as
>> a technical-intellectual pursuit yes, but that's it.
>>
>> Proper URLs are the only real way forward ...
>
> I see, thanks for your opinon. If I remember correctly most
> developers are sending also html links...

Well ... anytime mate.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Gnus: How to reference an article from a gmane mailing list

[Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor]

H. Dieter Wilhelm wrote:

> Now and then I see that people referencing posts from
> mailing lists. Is there a key in Gnus to do this? It seems
> I'm lacking the necessary keywords to find something
> relevant in DuckDuckGo or in the Gnus Info manual..

IIUC there isn't a Gmane archive so unless the mailing list
software inserts it as a header it won't happen.

If you check out the headers that are somewhat related, those
would be

  List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor <help-gnu-emacs.gnu.org>
  List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/options/help-gnu-emacs>,
                    <mailto:help-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
  List-Archive: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs>
  List-Post: <mailto:help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
  List-Help: <mailto:help-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=help>
  List-Subscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/help-gnu-emacs>,
                  <mailto:help-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=subscribe>

As for Gmane, this link 522:

  Archived-At: <http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.help/134850>

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal