From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 20:45:39 +0300 Message-ID: <83egmllmf0.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87fv77barj.fsf@gnu.org> <87zj5fgpd8.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> <83h9rnp0yy.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3qnl70z.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> <837fsfm7gq.fsf@gnu.org> <991d9b3f-e2f4-4977-9e78-99d39b04ede5@default> <53fc8fd4-2a3e-4937-bc17-6bf6d5bfff5a@googlegroups.com> <0d865b33-6751-4958-b61b-e0f2b3298a20@googlegroups.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1431453152 8659 80.91.229.3 (12 May 2015 17:52:32 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 17:52:32 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue May 12 19:52:24 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YsELw-0004uY-9W for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 19:52:24 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44307 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YsELv-0000g5-RA for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 13:52:23 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53886) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YsEFg-0008UR-15 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 13:45:57 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YsEFa-0001KM-SH for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 13:45:55 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:42904) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YsEFa-0001Jr-EG for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 13:45:50 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NO800M00ZUTUC00@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 20:45:48 +0300 (IDT) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NO900MEB00ATW10@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 12 May 2015 20:45:46 +0300 (IDT) In-reply-to: <0d865b33-6751-4958-b61b-e0f2b3298a20@googlegroups.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 X-Received-From: 80.179.55.166 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:104421 Archived-At: > Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 09:55:47 -0700 (PDT) > From: Rusi > > > Each chapter in the Emacs manual is a short intro to the subject of > > that chapter. > > There is a fundamental difference between logical and pedagogical order. Indeed, it is. But I don't see the relevance of that to the issue at hand. > The emacs manual may be logically structured. No, it is intended to be pedagogically structured. If you find evidence to the contrary, i.e. style that is typical of academic papers, please report that as a bug. > Joe Noob has a need that is completely covered in chaps i,(more likely i,j,k) > of the manual. How does he go from his need to chaps i,j,k? Via cross-references and menus, of course. And via index search. > Lets say that dired and even better wdired is exactly what he needs. How is he > going to find that out? I would start by typing "i directory TAB", then see "directory listing" there, and select it. And there, lo and behold, I'd see this: The file system groups files into "directories". A "directory listing" is a list of all the files in a directory. Emacs provides commands to create and delete directories, and to make directory listings in brief format (file names only) and verbose format (sizes, dates, and authors included). Emacs also includes a directory browser feature called Dired; see *note Dired::. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^ Then I'd follow that Dired hyperlink, and in the menu, due to some sheer luck (or maybe something else) I'd see this, inter alia: * Wdired:: Operating on files by editing the Dired buffer. and also * Image-Dired:: Viewing image thumbnails in Dired. and lots of other interesting and relevant topics.