From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals Date: Mon, 11 May 2015 18:58:45 +0300 Message-ID: <837fsfm7gq.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87fv77barj.fsf@gnu.org> <87zj5fgpd8.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> <83h9rnp0yy.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3qnl70z.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1431359969 31664 80.91.229.3 (11 May 2015 15:59:29 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 11 May 2015 15:59:29 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon May 11 17:59:14 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Yrq6r-0000tv-Kc for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 17:59:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38419 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yrq6r-0005cV-6r for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 11:59:13 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:56046) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yrq6h-0005cK-Ef for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 11:59:04 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yrq6d-0005tv-Dk for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 11:59:03 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]:59063) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yrq6d-0005tO-5L for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 11:58:59 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NO70080009ER300@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 18:58:56 +0300 (IDT) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NO7008WB0E7KP30@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 11 May 2015 18:58:55 +0300 (IDT) In-reply-to: <87r3qnl70z.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 X-Received-From: 80.179.55.172 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:104381 Archived-At: > From: phillip.lord@newcastle.ac.uk (Phillip Lord) > Cc: > Date: Mon, 11 May 2015 11:53:32 +0100 > > >What's a tutorial about an editor supposed to start with, if not > > basic cursor motion? Which other editor has its tutorial start > > with something else? > > https://atom.io/docs/v0.198.0/ > > Starts with "why atom is cool". Waste of the student's time, if you ask me. But if someone wants to add a similar section to the Emacs tutorial (with a "skip" button ;-), why not? > Then explains basic concepts (including > "buffers" which mean exactly the same thing as in Emacs). The packages. And then, tada! "Moving in Atom". So it's not so different, except that it risks losing its audience while explaining the basics, which the Emacs tutorial does seamlessly as part of describing the commands. > It does have a section on moving around, including keybindings, but it > starts by saying "using a mouse or the arrow keys works well". So do we: You can also use the PageUp and PageDn keys to move by screenfuls, if your terminal has them, but you can edit more efficiently if you use C-v and M-v. [...] You can use the arrow keys, but it's more efficient to keep your hands in the standard position and use the commands C-p, C-b, C-f, and C-n. > Their basic introduction also includes snippets, version control, > autocomplete and folding. Making the tutorial much longer. But we could add some of that as well. And here's another example: http://linuxconfig.org/vim-tutorial It also starts with cursor movement.