Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[uzibalqa]

Currently in elisp-mode comments, words within single quotes get highlighted.  It would 
be beneficial if arbitrary text is also highlighted within single quotes (e.g. text with 
spaces).

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Emanuel Berg]

uzibalqa wrote:

> Currently in elisp-mode

It is `emacs-lisp-mode', but I agree there should be an
"elisp-mode" alias. Here:

(defalias 'elisp-mode #'emacs-lisp-mode)

https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/ide/elisp.el

> comments, words within single quotes get highlighted.
> It would be beneficial if arbitrary text is also highlighted
> within single quotes (e.g. text with spaces).

I don't understand what 'ooh' and 'ooh aah' means in Elisp,
do you?

But it is clear the oohs and the aahs are treated differently
by Emacs as 'ooh' gets the `font-lock-constant-face' and with
the whitespace, as you say, it doesn't.

You can evaluate 'ooh' (into ooh) but not use it in code,
'ooh aah' cannot be evaluated.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[uzibalqa]

------- Original Message -------
On Monday, July 17th, 2023 at 11:08 AM, Emanuel Berg <incal@dataswamp.org> wrote:


> uzibalqa wrote:
> 
> > Currently in elisp-mode
> 
> 
> It is `emacs-lisp-mode', but I agree there should be an
> "elisp-mode" alias. Here:
> 
> (defalias 'elisp-mode #'emacs-lisp-mode)
> 
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/ide/elisp.el
> 
> > comments, words within single quotes get highlighted.
> > It would be beneficial if arbitrary text is also highlighted
> > within single quotes (e.g. text with spaces).
> 
> 
> I don't understand what 'ooh' and 'ooh aah' means in Elisp,
> do you?
> 
> But it is clear the oohs and the aahs are treated differently
> by Emacs as 'ooh' gets the `font-lock-constant-face' and with
> the whitespace, as you say, it doesn't.
> 
> You can evaluate 'ooh' (into ooh) but not use it in code,
> 'ooh aah' cannot be evaluated.

Highlighting some text in comments would be beneficial.

Consider a line showing usage of a function with a description 
beneath it.  Highlighting the usage code part would help readability. 

RE: [External] : Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Drew Adams]

> Consider a line showing usage of a function with a description
> beneath it.  Highlighting the usage code part would help readability.

`M-x report-emacs-bug' to request an enhancement.
This is a help list.  The bug list is the best
place to suggest improvements.  (Nothing wrong
with communicating suggestions here, but the bug
list is a better place, in general.)

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Emanuel Berg]

uzibalqa wrote:

>>> comments, words within single quotes get highlighted.
>>> It would be beneficial if arbitrary text is also
>>> highlighted within single quotes (e.g. text with spaces).
>> 
>> I don't understand what 'ooh' and 'ooh aah' means in Elisp,
>> do you?
>> 
>> But it is clear the oohs and the aahs are treated
>> differently by Emacs as 'ooh' gets the
>> `font-lock-constant-face' and with the whitespace, as you
>> say, it doesn't.
>> 
>> You can evaluate 'ooh' (into ooh) but not use it in code,
>> 'ooh aah' cannot be evaluated.
>
> Highlighting some text in comments would be beneficial.

But comments are already font locked into
`font-lock-comment-face' (there is also
a `font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').

I don't see why 'ooh' within a comment should be colorized any
other way than the comment, since that syntax don't denote
anything in Elisp. If you intend to use it as labels, and to
put them aside as a special color, I'd say there are better
ways to do that, namely stack semi-colons in different numbers
denoting different things, so that, for example

;; this is a general comment <-- one face

(setq one 1) ; don't do that <-- comment that refers to one line

;;; this is a LABEL, as seen in Lisp packages <-- one face for that
(code (code ...)
(code (code ...)

This would also be safe to implement because if someone didn't
like it, it could be default be set so that all those Lisp
levels of comments initially were set to the same color.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[uzibalqa]

------- Original Message -------
On Wednesday, July 19th, 2023 at 1:02 PM, Emanuel Berg <incal@dataswamp.org> wrote:


> uzibalqa wrote:
> 
> > > > comments, words within single quotes get highlighted.
> > > > It would be beneficial if arbitrary text is also
> > > > highlighted within single quotes (e.g. text with spaces).
> > > 
> > > I don't understand what 'ooh' and 'ooh aah' means in Elisp,
> > > do you?
> > > 
> > > But it is clear the oohs and the aahs are treated
> > > differently by Emacs as 'ooh' gets the
> > > `font-lock-constant-face' and with the whitespace, as you
> > > say, it doesn't.
> > > 
> > > You can evaluate 'ooh' (into ooh) but not use it in code,
> > > 'ooh aah' cannot be evaluated.
> > 
> > Highlighting some text in comments would be beneficial.
> 
> 
> But comments are already font locked into
> `font-lock-comment-face' (there is also a` font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
> have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').

I do not see the usefulness  of colouring the comment delimiter separately (because that
affects all comments in the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).  We can keep
highlighting with a back-quote for things that can be evaluated (e.g. `something') and 
use single-quote for more general case that allows spaces (e.g. 'this and that').

We should not use multiple comment characters (e.g. ;;; Something) because those are
for outlines - something of a completely different orthogonal purpose.

 
> I don't see why 'ooh' within a comment should be colorized any
> other way than the comment, since that syntax don't denote
> anything in Elisp. If you intend to use it as labels, and to
> put them aside as a special color, I'd say there are better
> ways to do that, namely stack semi-colons in different numbers
> denoting different things, so that, for example
> 
> ;; this is a general comment <-- one face
> 
> (setq one 1) ; don't do that <-- comment that refers to one line
> 
> ;;; this is a LABEL, as seen in Lisp packages <-- one face for that
> (code (code ...)
> (code (code ...)
> 
> This would also be safe to implement because if someone didn't
> like it, it could be default be set so that all those Lisp
> levels of comments initially were set to the same color.
> 
> --
> underground experts united
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Emanuel Berg]

uzibalqa wrote:

>> But comments are already font locked into
>> `font-lock-comment-face' (there is also a`
>> font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
>> have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').
>
> I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).

Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
including the delimiters.

> We can keep highlighting with a back-quote for things that
> can be evaluated (e.g. `something')

Agreed, that is the exception that proves the rule. I could
also think of hyperlinking them to the help, as has been
suggested not that long ago. In ERC it is already like that
BTW, and here is some more work on that:

  https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/erc/erc-man.el

  https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/erc/erc-show-modes.el

But putting point at the beginning of `something' and doing
`C-h f' isn't that much of a deal, which is the reason I think
no one has cared about it enough to do it.

But I like all integration things, big and small, so why not.
Here it should be noted that they already get
`font-lock-constant-face', if it sounds here like nothing at
all happens to the poor things.

> and use single-quote for more general case that allows
> spaces (e.g. 'this and that').

But what do that express? What's the intended usage? Can you
provide a piece of Elisp, where you use that proposed syntax
for us to see?

> We should not use multiple comment characters (e.g. ;;;
> Something) because those are for outlines - something of
> a completely different orthogonal purpose.

As long as it has a purpose, it can be font locked in
a distinguished way. If it should, in this case, is another
thing, but it could, and it wouldn't be wrong to do. But if it
should, I don't know, especially since comments in a uniform
color simply looks  much better.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Emanuel Berg <incal@dataswamp.org>
> Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2023 08:00:30 +0200
> 
> uzibalqa wrote:
> 
> >> But comments are already font locked into
> >> `font-lock-comment-face' (there is also a`
> >> font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
> >> have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').
> >
> > I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> > delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> > the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).
> 
> Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
> including the delimiters.

Font-lock is not just about colors, so this feature is still useful.

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[uzibalqa]

------- Original Message -------
On Saturday, July 22nd, 2023 at 6:00 PM, Emanuel Berg <incal@dataswamp.org> wrote:


> uzibalqa wrote:
> 
> > > But comments are already font locked into
> > > `font-lock-comment-face' (there is also a`
> > > font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
> > > have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').
> > 
> > I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> > delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> > the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).
> 
> 
> Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
> including the delimiters.
> 
> > We can keep highlighting with a back-quote for things that
> > can be evaluated (e.g. `something')
> 
> 
> Agreed, that is the exception that proves the rule. I could
> also think of hyperlinking them to the help, as has been
> suggested not that long ago. In ERC it is already like that
> BTW, and here is some more work on that:
> 
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/erc/erc-man.el
> 
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/erc/erc-show-modes.el
> 
> But putting point at the beginning of `something' and doing` C-h f' isn't that much of a deal, which is the reason I think
> no one has cared about it enough to do it.
> 
> But I like all integration things, big and small, so why not.

It is a very good strategy, and also of that school.

> Here it should be noted that they already get
> `font-lock-constant-face', if it sounds here like nothing at
> all happens to the poor things.
> 
> > and use single-quote for more general case that allows
> > spaces (e.g. 'this and that').
> 
> 
> But what do that express? What's the intended usage? Can you
> provide a piece of Elisp, where you use that proposed syntax
> for us to see?

Besides using comment for descriptive purposes, I use it for FIX-THIS,
IMPROVE-THIS, DEVELOP-THIS, PENDING.

;; PENDING
;;   'OMS GMBL'
;;      1st Fail Y Down
;;      2nd Fail P Down if P not -2.5 to +2.5 
;;   'FF MDM I/O Error'
;;      I/O Reset
 
This is an example for elisp but my intention is to have this
for any language (C, C++, Fortran).  For these types of tasks,
colouring will enhance the visibility of these phrases and make 
them stand out, immediately close to the section of code of 
relevanece.

It is not the routine thing for everybody, but colouring
within comments has benefits for things besides general
description.

> > We should not use multiple comment characters (e.g. ;;;
> > Something) because those are for outlines - something of
> > a completely different orthogonal purpose.
> 
> 
> As long as it has a purpose, it can be font locked in
> a distinguished way. If it should, in this case, is another
> thing, but it could, and it wouldn't be wrong to do. But if it
> should, I don't know, especially since comments in a uniform
> color simply looks much better.

Comments in uniform colour has the advantage that one can change the
intensity of the text in some situations.
 
So perhaps use font lock on the comments as you say.  One just need to be
careful because some modes might reset whatever I try to do.

> --
> underground experts united
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Christopher Dimech]

> Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 12:02 AM
> From: "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@gnu.org>
> To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments
>
> > From: Emanuel Berg <incal@dataswamp.org>
> > Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2023 08:00:30 +0200
> >
> > uzibalqa wrote:
> >
> > >> But comments are already font locked into
> > >> `font-lock-comment-face' (there is also a`
> > >> font-lock-comment-delimiter-face', IMO it is overkill to
> > >> have that in another color than `font-lock-comment-face').
> > >
> > > I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> > > delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> > > the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).
> >
> > Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
> > including the delimiters.
>
> Font-lock is not just about colors, so this feature is still useful.

What feature is useful ? Highlighting comment-delimiter with a different colour ?
I agree with Emanuel,  Why would one use another color than `font-lock-comment-face'
for `comment-delimiter' ?

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Christopher Dimech <dimech@gmx.com>
> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2023 15:49:46 +0200
> 
> > > > I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> > > > delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> > > > the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).
> > >
> > > Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
> > > including the delimiters.
> >
> > Font-lock is not just about colors, so this feature is still useful.
> 
> What feature is useful ?

The fact that font-lock-delimiter-face is a separate face.

> Highlighting comment-delimiter with a different colour ?
> I agree with Emanuel,  Why would one use another color than `font-lock-comment-face'
> for `comment-delimiter' ?

Like I said: faces are not just about colors.  There are other
attributes, and users can decide to customize
font-lock-comment-delimiter-face to look differently even though it
uses the same colors.

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Heime]

------- Original Message -------
On Sunday, July 23rd, 2023 at 2:16 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:


> > From: Christopher Dimech dimech@gmx.com
> > Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> > Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2023 15:49:46 +0200
> > 
> > > > > I do not see the usefulness of coloring the comment
> > > > > delimiter separately (because that affects all comments in
> > > > > the same way, no distinguishing feature whatsoever ).
> > > > 
> > > > Indeed, I think all comments should be of the same color,
> > > > including the delimiters.
> > > 
> > > Font-lock is not just about colors, so this feature is still useful.
> > 
> > What feature is useful ?
> 
> 
> The fact that font-lock-delimiter-face is a separate face.
> 
> > Highlighting comment-delimiter with a different colour ?
> > I agree with Emanuel, Why would one use another color than `font-lock-comment-face' for` comment-delimiter' ?
> 
> 
> Like I said: faces are not just about colors. There are other
> attributes, and users can decide to customize
> font-lock-comment-delimiter-face to look differently even though it
> uses the same colors.

Interesting.  Any knowledge of a good use excluding colouring purposes ?

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2023 14:22:21 +0000
> From: Heime <heimeborgia@protonmail.com>
> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> 
> > Like I said: faces are not just about colors. There are other
> > attributes, and users can decide to customize
> > font-lock-comment-delimiter-face to look differently even though it
> > uses the same colors.
> 
> Interesting.  Any knowledge of a good use excluding colouring purposes ?   

No, sorry.

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Emanuel Berg]

uzibalqa wrote:

> Besides using comment for descriptive purposes, I use it for
> FIX-THIS, IMPROVE-THIS, DEVELOP-THIS, PENDING.
>
> ;; PENDING
> ;;   'OMS GMBL'
> ;;      1st Fail Y Down
> ;;      2nd Fail P Down if P not -2.5 to +2.5 
> ;;   'FF MDM I/O Error'
> ;;      I/O Reset

I think 'this' is an ugly syntax for that purpose, it looks
like the intention is ironic. Fix this as 'soon' as
possible ...

But moreover, I don't think we want to encourage people to
insert those as they make the code ugly - especially if given
a certain face, what would happen is people would develop
"code blindness", instead of seeing the source they would see
a bunch of "programming programmers" directives.

In Elisp, one could denote, say, three initiators to denote
a heading or label

;;; Brilliant Code Below

because that convention already exists in Emacs packages, see

  https://dataswamp.org/~incal/emacs-init/wrap-search.el

only the trailing colon would be optional. (I'm not sure what
they are called as it is, what did you say - overlay? - anyway
if three initiators must be reserved for that and only that
one could say that _four_ initiators denote a heading or label.)

Then a single one would be a comment relating to that
particular line

(cl-incf x) ; I think it can take one more

and two initiators for an arbitrary number of lines below;
also, for general comment use.

It would look like this

;;;; Duncan's code

;; now we are entering murky water
(setq x 1)
(cl-incf x) ; I think it can take one more

You can see how that works with `message-mode' (the angle
brackets) in this screenshot:

  https://dataswamp.org/~incal/figures/emacs/emacsuxusubmarinespetsnaz.png

Those are the `gnus-cite-1' all the way up to `gnus-cite-11'.

We could have that in Elisp as well, either by a similar
enumeration, or by calling the faces something to denote what
their intended usage are.

But then we would hurry to make sure that all the specific
comment faces would initially be unset, and inherit from
a base comment face. That way all comments would still get the
same color, because it is the way I like it anyway, and in the
example above, because of the blank lines not the least, I can
see quite clearly what is intended as a heading and what
isn't. Distinct face would make it even more clear in that
specific sense yes, but in general it would make the code
dizzy and unrestful and too much attention would land on the
comments, that we want to be low-key, instead of the code.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Words with spaces highlighted in elisp-mode comments

[Emanuel Berg]

Christopher Dimech wrote:

> I agree with Emanuel, Why would one use another color than
> `font-lock-comment-face' for `comment-delimiter' ?

The only thing I can think of is so that you can find them
faster in languages that support multiline comments

/* Master Yoda
   yada yada
   etc */
  
-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal