mthesaur v synonyms

mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

Does anyone have an opinion on what is better?

http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/mthesaur.el
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/synonyms.el

The second is based on the first.

The second seems to be "newer" and has a cache so I am going with that
for now.

Does anyone have a patch to enable the command synonyms to show the
word-at-point in the command buffer when I call it using a kbd binding?

(It does assume the word at point but just doesn't show it in the
prompt).

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> Does anyone have an opinion on what is better?
>
> http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/mthesaur.el
> http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/synonyms.el

Yes, synonyms.el ;-).

> The second is based on the first. The second seems to be "newer"
> and has a cache so I am going with that for now.
>
> Does anyone have a patch to enable the command synonyms to show the
> word-at-point in the command buffer when I call it using a kbd binding?
> (It does assume the word at point but just doesn't show it in the
> prompt).

Not sure what you mean by "in the command buffer". If you mean the
minibuffer, then just use `M-n' to pull the default value, which is the word
at point, into the minibuffer as your input. Edit it if you like, before
hitting RET.

If you also use Icicles, and you want the default value to _always_ be
inserted in the minibuffer as the initial input, then customize
`icicle-init-value-flag' to `insert'. I personally prefer that behavior, but
I think most people do not.

If you also use thingatpt+.el, then `synonyms' will pick up the word nearest
point as the default value - the cursor need not be exactly on a word.

FWIW - Some vanilla Emacs prompts include the default value in the prompt -
e.g. "(default: foobar)". I do not follow that convention in my code. 1) The
default value is always available anyway as input via `M-n'. 2) I personally
always have the default value inserted as the initial input
(`icicle-init-value-flag' = `insert').

Wrt #2: I prefer to have the value available immediately as editable input.
Rather than waste prompt space, I use the input space - I can always empty
the minibuffer (via `M-k' in Icicles) if I don't want to use the default
value. In sum, I prefer to have to hit a key (`M-k') to get rid of an
unwanted default value, rather than to have to hit a key (`M-n') to retrieve
the default value. This is because I use the default value (possibly editing
it) most of the time.

HTH - Drew

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> Does anyone have an opinion on what is better?
>>
>> http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/mthesaur.el
>> http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/synonyms.el
>
> Yes, synonyms.el ;-).
>
>> The second is based on the first. The second seems to be "newer"
>> and has a cache so I am going with that for now.
>>
>> Does anyone have a patch to enable the command synonyms to show the
>> word-at-point in the command buffer when I call it using a kbd binding?
>> (It does assume the word at point but just doesn't show it in the
>> prompt).
>
> Not sure what you mean by "in the command buffer". If you mean the
> minibuffer, then just use `M-n' to pull the default value, which is
> the word

I did.

> at point, into the minibuffer as your input. Edit it if you like, before
> hitting RET.
>
> If you also use Icicles, and you want the default value to _always_ be
> inserted in the minibuffer as the initial input, then customize
> `icicle-init-value-flag' to `insert'. I personally prefer that behavior, but
> I think most people do not.

Any command which replies on word-at-point should default it IMO. I have
now got icicles ( cant say I like it at first attempt - there's a lot
there :)) and set the flag as above and its much better. Although if
something is pre-selected then typing should erase it, not append to
it. That would be a nice fix.

Do you know if I can stop f5 being bound by icicles by normal customization?

>
> If you also use thingatpt+.el, then `synonyms' will pick up the word nearest
> point as the default value - the cursor need not be exactly on a word.

Something else new to try....

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

>
> FWIW - Some vanilla Emacs prompts include the default value in the prompt -
> e.g. "(default: foobar)". I do not follow that convention in my code. 1) The
> default value is always available anyway as input via `M-n'. 2) I personally
> always have the default value inserted as the initial input
> (`icicle-init-value-flag' = `insert').
>
> Wrt #2: I prefer to have the value available immediately as editable input.
> Rather than waste prompt space, I use the input space - I can always empty
> the minibuffer (via `M-k' in Icicles) if I don't want to use the default
> value. In sum, I prefer to have to hit a key (`M-k') to get rid of an
> unwanted default value, rather than to have to hit a key (`M-n') to retrieve
> the default value. This is because I use the default value (possibly editing
> it) most of the time.
>
> HTH - Drew
>

-- 

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> > at point, into the minibuffer as your input. Edit it if you like, before
> > hitting RET.
> >
> > If you also use Icicles, and you want the default value to _always_ be
> > inserted in the minibuffer as the initial input, then customize
> > `icicle-init-value-flag' to `insert'. I personally prefer that
> > behavior, but I think most people do not.
>
> Any command which replies on word-at-point should default it IMO.

Not sure what you mean.

> I have now got icicles ( cant say I like it at first attempt -
> there's a lot there :)) and set the flag as above and its much
> better. Although if something is pre-selected then typing should
> erase it, not append to it. That would be a nice fix.

Use `delete-selection-mode' to type over selected text (region).

To automatically have the initial value be preselected in the minibuffer,
use `preselect-start' or `preselect-end' as the value of
`icicle-init-value-flag', depending on where you want the cursor to be.

I use `insert' as the value, because I don't want the initial input
preselected. I generally edit it only slightly - I don't want to replace it
entirely.

> Do you know if I can stop f5 being bound by icicles by normal
> customization?

(define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'whatever-you-want)

Put that on `icicle-mode-hook' if you want.

Or, if you also do not want other top-level commands rebound by Icicles,
customize option `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil.

HTH

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> > at point, into the minibuffer as your input. Edit it if you like, before
>> > hitting RET.
>> >
>> > If you also use Icicles, and you want the default value to _always_ be
>> > inserted in the minibuffer as the initial input, then customize
>> > `icicle-init-value-flag' to `insert'. I personally prefer that
>> > behavior, but I think most people do not.
>>
>> Any command which replies on word-at-point should default it IMO.
>
> Not sure what you mean.

When the prompt comes up it should be there (just a general note - the
icicle-init-value-flag did it for me).

>
>> I have now got icicles ( cant say I like it at first attempt -
>> there's a lot there :)) and set the flag as above and its much
>> better. Although if something is pre-selected then typing should
>> erase it, not append to it. That would be a nice fix.
>
> Use `delete-selection-mode' to type over selected text (region).

Heh. Emacs. Wonderful. Although it should be the default IMO.

>
> To automatically have the initial value be preselected in the minibuffer,
> use `preselect-start' or `preselect-end' as the value of
> `icicle-init-value-flag', depending on where you want the cursor to
> be.

Yeah, did that and it works fine.

>
> I use `insert' as the value, because I don't want the initial input
> preselected. I generally edit it only slightly - I don't want to replace it
> entirely.

The default in most apps when you tab or select a field is to hilite the
word. If you want to edit then cursor in. Just a preference, but the
wonderful configuration here allows all flavours. Impressive.

>
>> Do you know if I can stop f5 being bound by icicles by normal
>> customization?
>
> (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'whatever-you-want)

ok.

>
> Put that on `icicle-mode-hook' if you want.
>
> Or, if you also do not want other top-level commands rebound by Icicles,
> customize option `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil.

I set this, but f5 still run icicle-cmd. Did I understand right that it
should stop the f5/top level bindings altogether? 

(I have all my personal organization /planner stuff on f5)

>
> HTH
>
>
>
>

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

Hadron <hadronquark@googlemail.com> writes:

> "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:
*snip*

Drew, I am tempted to try out your entire library suite. But I cant seem
to find a tar file? Do you have a link?

http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/DrewsElispLibraries#DrewsLibraries

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> > at point, into the minibuffer as your input. Edit it if you like, before
>> > hitting RET.
>> >
>> > If you also use Icicles, and you want the default value to _always_ be
>> > inserted in the minibuffer as the initial input, then customize
>> > `icicle-init-value-flag' to `insert'. I personally prefer that
>> > behavior, but I think most people do not.
>>
>> Any command which replies on word-at-point should default it IMO.
>
> Not sure what you mean.
>
>> I have now got icicles ( cant say I like it at first attempt -
>> there's a lot there :)) and set the flag as above and its much
>> better. Although if something is pre-selected then typing should
>> erase it, not append to it. That would be a nice fix.
>
> Use `delete-selection-mode' to type over selected text (region).
>
> To automatically have the initial value be preselected in the minibuffer,
> use `preselect-start' or `preselect-end' as the value of
> `icicle-init-value-flag', depending on where you want the cursor to be.
>
> I use `insert' as the value, because I don't want the initial input
> preselected. I generally edit it only slightly - I don't want to replace it
> entirely.

FYI,  I have (setq icicle-init-value-flag (quote preselect-end)) and have
noticed an annoying "bug" (I guess bug but I suspect you will tell me
how to modify it so it does what I want :-)) This is conjunction with
delete-selection-mode.

If you bring up file-open, C-x C-f, then the first option (home dir in
this example) is there and preselected with the cursor at the end. If I
hit "end" or right cursor then it should unselect the text and
append. As it is, its behaviour seems inconcistent. Right cursor says
"end of buffer", "end" does nothing. In both cases the text stays
selected which means any typing removes the base path.

e.g bring up  file open, "~/" is the hilited default. There is no easy way
to append to this in "preselect" mode. If I cursor left, the select is
dropped but when I cursor right again the "~"is reselected for some
reason.

I prefer not to  use "insert" mode as I am too used to "preselect" modes in other
apps I use so any advice on the above would be appreciated.

>
>> Do you know if I can stop f5 being bound by icicles by normal
>> customization?
>
> (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'whatever-you-want)
>
> Put that on `icicle-mode-hook' if you want.
>
> Or, if you also do not want other top-level commands rebound by Icicles,
> customize option `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil.
>
> HTH
>
>
>
>

-- 

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> Drew, I am tempted to try out your entire library suite. But I cant seem
> to find a tar file? Do you have a link?
>
> http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/DrewsElispLibraries#DrewsLibraries

No. However, see this for some ways to download all of Icicles at once:
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/Icicles_-_Libraries#BulkIciclesDownloa
d

Different libraries I posted to the wiki are for different Emacs versions.
Some are old; some are new. Some of the old ones are not very useful
anymore. Some stuff is posted to the wiki just in case someone wants to mine
it.

In any case, it's best not to try everything at once, IMO. Pick something
and give it a try.

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> > Use `delete-selection-mode' to type over selected text (region).
>
> Heh. Emacs. Wonderful. Although it should be the default IMO.

I agree. At least `transient-mark-mode' (which is used by
`delete-selection-mode') should be the default. This topic comes up for
discussion about once a year on the emacs-devel mailing list, but so far it
is not the default.

> > I use `insert' as the value, because I don't want the initial input
> > preselected. I generally edit it only slightly - I don't want
> > to replace it entirely.
>
> The default in most apps when you tab or select a field is to hilite the
> word. If you want to edit then cursor in. Just a preference, but the
> wonderful configuration here allows all flavours. Impressive.

Different people have different preferences, especially for UI. It's
important to try to accommodate them, within the given overall UI design.
Some people will of course want changes to the design itself. It's hard to
please everyone, but some effort should be made to accommodate minor
differences.

> > Or, if you also do not want other top-level commands rebound by Icicles,
> > customize option `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil.
>
> I set this, but f5 still run icicle-cmd.

`icicle-cmd' does not exist. There is a file `icicles-cmd.el'. f5 is bound
by Icicles only to `icicle-kmacro', and only if
`icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' is non-nil.

> Did I understand right that it
> should stop the f5/top level bindings altogether?

Yes. Please make sure you have the latest `icicle-mode.el'. When
`icicle-mode' is entered, this test is made:

(when icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag
  (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro))

If icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag is nil, f5 should not be touched by
Icicles. If you see another behavior, please file a bug report
(`icicle-send-bug-report'), starting from "emacs -Q".

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> FYI,  I have (setq icicle-init-value-flag (quote preselect-end)) and have
> noticed an annoying "bug" (I guess bug but I suspect you will tell me
> how to modify it so it does what I want :-)) This is conjunction with
> delete-selection-mode.
>
> If you bring up file-open, C-x C-f, then the first option (home dir in
> this example) is there and preselected with the cursor at the end. If I
> hit "end" or right cursor then it should unselect the text and
> append. As it is, its behaviour seems inconcistent. Right cursor says
> "end of buffer", "end" does nothing. In both cases the text stays
> selected which means any typing removes the base path.
>
> e.g bring up  file open, "~/" is the hilited default. There is no easy way
> to append to this in "preselect" mode. If I cursor left, the select is
> dropped but when I cursor right again the "~"is reselected for some
> reason.

That's delete-selection mode. Cursor movement extends the selection; it does
not unselect. This applies to both the arrow keys (e.g. `right') and `end'.

To unselect (that is, to deactivate the mark) in delete-selection mode, you
can use `C-g', but that won't work during minibuffer input - the current
command will just be canceled.

Alternatively, you can hit `C-SPC' to set the mark. That's what I recommend
in this case: instead of hitting `right' or `end', hit `C-SPC'. Usually, if
you don't want to use the current selection, you don't mind setting the mark
at point.

Doing that gives you the same effect as using `insert' as the value of
`icicle-init-value-flag', but it does so only on demand. That sounds like
what you want: have the init value selected for easy replacement or
deletion, but be able to cancel the selection whenever you want.

I choose the opposite approach: I use `insert' as the flag value, because I
usually do not want to replace or delete the whole input (I edit parts of
it), and I then use `C-x h' when I want to select the whole input.

> I prefer not to  use "insert" mode as I am too used to
> "preselect" modes in other
> apps I use so any advice on the above would be appreciated.

It often happens that Emacs provides additional features unavailable in
other apps, and carrying over the UI exactly from other apps to Emacs can
conflict to some extent with being able to use those additional features.

In many cases, Emacs has provided ways to get some of the more common UI
behavior, without also sacrificing the extra functionality that Emacs
provides. But there is often a certain tension, and this can be a delicate
balancing act.

Sometimes it's better to take Emacs at its word and try to get used to its
UI. In many cases it's superior, and the change in old habits is worth it.

The problem comes in moving back and forth between Emacs and other apps.
Some people, for instance use cua-mode to avoid finger/brain confusion over
C-x, C-c, etc. The one that trips me up the most is C-s - I occasionally hit
C-s in Emacs, intending to save, because I've been using another app for a
while.

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

> Yes. Please make sure you have the latest `icicle-mode.el'. When
> `icicle-mode' is entered, this test is made:
>
> (when icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag
>   (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro))

In the one here : 

   http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/download/icicles-mode.el

the code is:

    (when (fboundp 'icicle-kmacro)
      (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro)) ; `f5' Emacs 22

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

Hadron <hadronquark@googlemail.com> writes:

> "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:
>
>> Yes. Please make sure you have the latest `icicle-mode.el'. When
>> `icicle-mode' is entered, this test is made:
>>
>> (when icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag
>>   (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro))
>
> In the one here : 
>
>    http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/download/icicles-mode.el
>
> the code is:
>
>     (when (fboundp 'icicle-kmacro)
>       (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro)) ; `f5' Emacs 22
>

Please ignore. This was wrapped by the correct test. However I have some
glitches so if I dont suss them out I will report any bugs using the bug
reporting tools.

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> > Yes. Please make sure you have the latest `icicle-mode.el'. When
> > `icicle-mode' is entered, this test is made:
> >
> > (when icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag
> >   (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro))
>
> In the one here :
>    http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/download/icicles-mode.el
> the code is:
>
>     (when (fboundp 'icicle-kmacro)
>       (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro)) ; `f5' Emacs 22

No. This is the code:

(when icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag
  ...
  (when (fboundp 'icicle-kmacro)
    (define-key icicle-mode-map [f5] 'icicle-kmacro))
  ...)

IOW, the binding is made only if _both_
`icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' is non-nil and `icicle-kmacro' is
defined (which it is, for Emacs 22).

If you customize `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil, f5 should not
be rebound. Again, if you find a bug, please report it, starting with
"emacs -Q", via `icicle-send-bug-report'. Thanks.

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

> IOW, the binding is made only if _both_
> `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' is non-nil and `icicle-kmacro' is
> defined (which it is, for Emacs 22).
>
> If you customize `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil, f5 should not
> be rebound. Again, if you find a bug, please report it, starting with
> "emacs -Q", via `icicle-send-bug-report'. Thanks.

It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the customization is at the
end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
customization variable is set.

This worked for me:

,----
| (setq icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag nil)
| (require 'icicles)
| (icy-mode)
`----

thanks for your help - Icicles is growing on me. Gives me a tingly feeling
about just how powerful my emacs setup is getting now.

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> > IOW, the binding is made only if _both_
> > `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' is non-nil and `icicle-kmacro' is
> > defined (which it is, for Emacs 22).
> >
> > If you customize `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil,
> > f5 should not be rebound. Again, if you find a bug, please report
> > it, starting with "emacs -Q", via `icicle-send-bug-report'. Thanks.
>
> It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the
> customization is at the
> end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
> customization variable is set.

I think you're saying that there is no bug and things work OK for you now.

> This worked for me:
>
> ,----
> | (setq icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag nil)
> | (require 'icicles)
> | (icy-mode)
> `----

It should also work to use Customize. That is:

  M-x customize-option icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag

Customize is your friend, in general. For one thing, it does type-checking
of the values you assign to options.

> thanks for your help - Icicles is growing on me. Gives me a tingly feeling
> about just how powerful my emacs setup is getting now.

Emacs is awesome. But don't forget to go outdoors once in a while; exercise
and sun are good for you too ;-).

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> > IOW, the binding is made only if _both_
>> > `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' is non-nil and `icicle-kmacro' is
>> > defined (which it is, for Emacs 22).
>> >
>> > If you customize `icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag' to nil,
>> > f5 should not be rebound. Again, if you find a bug, please report
>> > it, starting with "emacs -Q", via `icicle-send-bug-report'. Thanks.
>>
>> It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the
>> customization is at the
>> end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
>> customization variable is set.
>
> I think you're saying that there is no bug and things work OK for you
> now.

Sorry. I wasn't clear. It only works for me with the code below. The
customization does not work because the key bindings are done before the
customization section is invoked I assume?

>
>> This worked for me:
>>
>> ,----
>> | (setq icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag nil)
>> | (require 'icicles)
>> | (icy-mode)
>> `----
>
> It should also work to use Customize. That is:
>
>   M-x customize-option icicle-bind-top-level-commands-flag

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> >> It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the
> >> customization is at the
> >> end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
> >> customization variable is set.
> >
> > I think you're saying that there is no bug and things work OK for you
> > now.
>
> Sorry. I wasn't clear. It only works for me with the code below. The
> customization does not work because the key bindings are done before the
> customization section is invoked I assume?

It all depends when your customizations (from Customize) are invoked. If
they are invoked after you've loaded Icicles, then, yes, some of them, like
this one, will have no effect, because the value will have already been
tested by Icicles.

Your customizations (from Customize) are in either your `custom-file' (if
non-nil) or your `user-init-file' (most likely `~/.emacs'). In the former
case, the behavior depends on when you load `custom-file' (e.g. from your
.emacs).

In the latter case, the behavior depends on where the customizations are
located in your .emacs. If they are evaluated before you enter Icicle mode,
you should be OK.

Re: mthesaur v synonyms

[Hadron]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> >> It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the
>> >> customization is at the
>> >> end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
>> >> customization variable is set.
>> >
>> > I think you're saying that there is no bug and things work OK for you
>> > now.
>>
>> Sorry. I wasn't clear. It only works for me with the code below. The
>> customization does not work because the key bindings are done before the
>> customization section is invoked I assume?
>
> It all depends when your customizations (from Customize) are invoked. If
> they are invoked after you've loaded Icicles, then, yes, some of them, like
> this one, will have no effect, because the value will have already been
> tested by Icicles.
>
> Your customizations (from Customize) are in either your `custom-file' (if
> non-nil) or your `user-init-file' (most likely `~/.emacs'). In the former
> case, the behavior depends on when you load `custom-file' (e.g. from your
> .emacs).
>
> In the latter case, the behavior depends on where the customizations are
> located in your .emacs. If they are evaluated before you enter Icicle mode,
> you should be OK.

They are in the default place afaik - at the end of the .emacs. I switch
on icy-mode in my .emacs. is there a bettter way to do it?

-- 

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

I said:

> It all depends when your customizations (from Customize) are invoked. If
> they are invoked after you've loaded Icicles, then, yes, some of
> them, like
> this one, will have no effect, because the value will have already been
> tested by Icicles.
>
> Your customizations (from Customize) are in either your `custom-file' (if
> non-nil) or your `user-init-file' (most likely `~/.emacs'). In the former
> case, the behavior depends on when you load `custom-file' (e.g. from your
> .emacs).
>
> In the latter case, the behavior depends on where the customizations are
> located in your .emacs. If they are evaluated before you enter
> Icicle mode,
> you should be OK.

I should add that there is another option for which this is also true,
because it too has an effect only at startup:
`icicle-touche-pas-aux-menus-flag'. I've added a note about this to the doc
string of each of these options. Thanks.

RE: mthesaur v synonyms

[Drew Adams]

> >> >> It's not a bug customising it doesn't work since the
> >> >> customization is at the
> >> >> end the .emacs the menu/keybinding code is called before the
> >> >> customization variable is set.
> >> >
> >> > I think you're saying that there is no bug and things work OK for you
> >> > now.
> >>
> >> Sorry. I wasn't clear. It only works for me with the code below. The
> >> customization does not work because the key bindings are done
> before the
> >> customization section is invoked I assume?
> >
> > It all depends when your customizations (from Customize) are invoked. If
> > they are invoked after you've loaded Icicles, then, yes, some
> of them, like
> > this one, will have no effect, because the value will have already been
> > tested by Icicles.
> >
> > Your customizations (from Customize) are in either your
> `custom-file' (if
> > non-nil) or your `user-init-file' (most likely `~/.emacs'). In
> the former
> > case, the behavior depends on when you load `custom-file' (e.g.
> from your
> > .emacs).
> >
> > In the latter case, the behavior depends on where the customizations are
> > located in your .emacs. If they are evaluated before you enter
> Icicle mode,
> > you should be OK.
>
> They are in the default place afaik - at the end of the .emacs. I switch
> on icy-mode in my .emacs. is there a bettter way to do it?

No, that's fine. But you will need to do as you are doing now: set the value
of this option before you enter Icicle mode.

Keep in mind that you can load Icicles and your customizations in any order.
What's important is that you don't turn on Icicle mode until after you have
set the option value the way you want it. When you enter Icicle mode, it
checks the value, and if it's nil, then it does not rebind f5 etc. That's
all.