From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Jean-Christophe Helary Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: "grouping" buffers Date: Sun, 31 May 2020 14:02:39 +0900 Message-ID: <5C48EC33-AB2C-4131-AF5F-2BF6D376EC2D@traduction-libre.org> References: <20200528005856.6bc0869e@jcubic> <38d5c557-715d-43b2-ae02-d0f73c3f3600@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.80.23.2.2\)) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="127117"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Help Gnu Emacs mailing list To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun May 31 07:03:31 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jfG8A-000WxE-J8 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 31 May 2020 07:03:30 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42870 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jfG89-0007QB-K4 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 31 May 2020 01:03:29 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50000) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jfG7W-0007PU-NH for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 31 May 2020 01:02:51 -0400 Original-Received: from relay6-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.198]:55693) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jfG7T-0005YZ-Mu for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 31 May 2020 01:02:50 -0400 X-Originating-IP: 128.53.64.23 Original-Received: from [10.0.1.13] (pl19991.ag0304.nttpc.ne.jp [128.53.64.23]) (Authenticated sender: jean.christophe.helary@traduction-libre.org) by relay6-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5B1FAC0004; Sun, 31 May 2020 05:02:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: <38d5c557-715d-43b2-ae02-d0f73c3f3600@default> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.80.23.2.2) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.70.183.198; envelope-from=jean.christophe.helary@traduction-libre.org; helo=relay6-d.mail.gandi.net X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/05/31 01:02:44 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:123196 Archived-At: Thank you Drew. > On May 31, 2020, at 12:49, Drew Adams wrote: >=20 >> The utilities for manipulating frames and buffers within frames >> are extremely limited. There does not seem to be a way to "name" a >> given frame,=20 >=20 > In `frame-cmds.el' you have command `rename-frame'. Doc: Sorry. The "default" utilities... I was only looking at the Emacs manual = and at some command names I found with C-h. Also, which-key shows that there are only very few C-x 5 prefixed = commands. =46rom a basic Emacs user=E2=80=99s point of view *that* is = extremely limited. Now that you mention the elisp manual, I checked it and found a few = interesting things. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Frame Titles > Every frame has a name parameter; this serves as the default for the = frame title which window systems typically display at the top of the = frame. You can specify a name explicitly by setting the name frame = property. I don't know how to "set the name frame property". But there is probably = a place in the elisp manual that says how to do that. I think there should be a command that does that in frame.el. > Normally you don=E2=80=99t specify the name explicitly, That's quite a statement... Maybe that should be "Normally Emacs computes..." > and Emacs computes the frame name automatically based on a template = stored in the variable frame-title-format. Emacs recomputes the name = each time the frame is redisplayed. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> or to call a frame to the front for example, like I'd call >> a buffer to the front.=20 >=20 > By "call to the front", do you mean select the frame, > giving it focus? That's standard command `select-frame' or > `select-frame-by-name' (or function `select-frame-set-focus'). When I call select-frame I get "command-execute: select-frame must be = bound to an event with parameters" I don't know what that means. Thanks to autocompletion I found about select-frame-by-name, and well, = that worked fine, but as far as I can tell it's documented neither in = the elisp manual nor in the emacs manual. >> I can call it to the front or to the back, I can modify its >> contents, I can rearrange the size and placement of each frame, etc. >=20 > Dunno what you mean by modify its contents. Since in macos 1 frame =3D 1 window =3D 1 buffer, I can write something = like "set contents of document (read "buffer") of front window (read = "frame") to [whatever]" But that was just an example of how frames are easy to manipulate and = access out of the box in macos/applescript. >> I can't seem to be able to do that in emacs for emacs frames. >=20 > Most frame changes are done ultimately with > `modify-frame-parameters'. I see. Maybe the section I quoted above could have an explicit link to = that section. I mean, *all* sections in the Emacs manual should have a = link to the relevant part of the Elisp manual... > The Elisp manual is > pretty good on this subject. Start with node > `Frames'. Indeed. Now it occurs to me that the tab feature that has been recently included = in Emacs is easier to use out of the box than frames. For ex, by default = I can call a menu where all the tabs are listed and I can select any one = of them. Although it is a different "menu", I just checked and F10 menu does have = a frame item but it's buried inside the Buffer item. In conclusion, I think there could be the following modifications to the = system to improve usability: Short term: 1) Assign a C-x 5 default keybinding to "select-frame-by-name" 2) Add a C-x 5 bound command for renaming a frame 3) Document select-frame-by-name in the 2 manuals 4) Move the F10 "Frames" menu item to the menu root Medium term: 4) Systematically add links to the Elisp manual in the Emacs manual. To = make sure that new users get a habit to checking the two. I also need to understand why "select-frame" spits that error message... Thank you again for the references. --=20 Jean-Christophe Helary @brandelune http://mac4translators.blogspot.com