Re: creating a sub-menu

Re: creating a sub-menu

[Joost Kremers]

ken wrote:
> Trying to create a sub-menu under "Edit".  Got part of the way there, 
> but still missing something.
>
> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [insert-xascii-chars]
>    '(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" xascii
>
>     (xascii  "\C-xaa"   "ä"        "ä` (ä)"          ("ä"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xaA"   "Ä"        "Ä` (Ä)"          ("Ä"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xao"   "ö"        "ö` (ö)"          ("ö"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xaO"   "Ö"        "Ö` (Ö)"          ("Ö"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xau"   "ü"        "ü` (ü)"          ("ü"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xaU"   "Ü"        "Ü` (Ü)"          ("Ü"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xas"   "ß"        "ß` (ß)"          ("ß"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xa<"   "«"        "«` («)"          ("«"))
>     (xascii  "\C-xa>"   "»"        "»` (»)"          ("»"))))
>
> Above yields error:
> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)

dunno about the error, but if all you want is to easily type German, why
don't you use an input method? `M-x set-input-method latin9-prefix RET'
and you can type "a to get ä, ~s to get ß, ~< to get «, etc.

(info "(emacs) Input Methods") for details.

HTH

-- 
Joost Kremers                                   joostkremers@fastmail.fm
Selbst in die Unterwelt dringt durch Spalten Licht
EN:SiS(9)

Re: creating a sub-menu

[ken]

n 03/05/2013 08:42 PM Joost Kremers wrote:
> ken wrote:
>> Trying to create a sub-menu under "Edit".  Got part of the way there,
>> but still missing something.
>>
>> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [insert-xascii-chars]
>>     '(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" xascii
>>
>>      (xascii  "\C-xaa"   "ä"        "ä` (ä)"          ("ä"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xaA"   "Ä"        "Ä` (Ä)"          ("Ä"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xao"   "ö"        "ö` (ö)"          ("ö"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xaO"   "Ö"        "Ö` (Ö)"          ("Ö"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xau"   "ü"        "ü` (ü)"          ("ü"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xaU"   "Ü"        "Ü` (Ü)"          ("Ü"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xas"   "ß"        "ß` (ß)"          ("ß"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xa<"   "«"        "«` («)"          ("«"))
>>      (xascii  "\C-xa>"   "»"        "»` (»)"          ("»"))))
>>
>> Above yields error:
>> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)
>
> dunno about the error, but if all you want is to easily type German, why
> don't you use an input method? `M-x set-input-method latin9-prefix RET'
> and you can type "a to get ä, ~s to get ß, ~< to get «, etc.
>
> (info "(emacs) Input Methods") for details.
>
> HTH

Thanks for your response, Joost.  But I already have an easier way than 
that to change the input method, one which takes just two mouse 
clicks... and then another two mouse clicks to return to my normal input 
method.  But I want a way so that all I need do is "C-xaa" to get 'ä'-- 
so I can type this and other characters without breaking the flow of my 
typing.  I want these listed in the menu also because I might not 
remember all the key combos for all the characters.  (I'll likely add 
more in future.)

Re: creating a sub-menu

[Joost Kremers]

ken wrote:
> Thanks for your response, Joost.  But I already have an easier way than 
> that to change the input method, one which takes just two mouse 
> clicks... and then another two mouse clicks to return to my normal input 
> method.

That's too much. It's also the wrong input medium. ;-) Toggling the
input method can be done with `C-\', which IMHO is much much easier and
quicker than using the mouse.

>  But I want a way so that all I need do is "C-xaa" to get 'ä'-- 
> so I can type this and other characters without breaking the flow of my 
> typing.

Using C-\ will allow you to do just that. (In fact, I don't see any
reason why one would want to disable the input method. When I type
German or Dutch, I just toggle the input method and keep it until I kill
the relevant buffer.)

>  I want these listed in the menu also because I might not 
> remember all the key combos for all the characters.  (I'll likely add 
> more in future.)

Well, I can't really help with the menu (I'm not even sure what this
xascii is...) but I do know that this error:

>>> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)

tells you that Emacs is expecting an array but getting xascii. In this
case the array Emacs is expecting must probably be either a string or a
vector, since a boolean vector or a char table doesn't seem to make
sense in a menu.

Don't know if that helps, though...

-- 
Joost Kremers                                   joostkremers@fastmail.fm
Selbst in die Unterwelt dringt durch Spalten Licht
EN:SiS(9)

OT w/ misunderstanding Re: creating a sub-menu

[ken]

Joost,

For some reason your replies (from the outset of this conversation) 
aren't showing up as part of one and the same thread.

On 03/06/2013 03:55 PM Joost Kremers wrote:
> ken wrote:
>> Thanks for your response, Joost.  But I already have an easier way than
>> that to change the input method, one which takes just two mouse
>> clicks... and then another two mouse clicks to return to my normal input
>> method.
>
> That's too much. It's also the wrong input medium. ;-) Toggling the
> input method can be done with `C-\', which IMHO is much much easier and
> quicker than using the mouse.

Thanks, Joost.  I have used that in the past.  It's okay if I'm using 
just two input methods, switching back and forth between them.  What if, 
though, I'm using three or four input methods?  And if I need to enter 
the '༣' character or the '§' or '¾' or 'ज्ञ' characters, how do I know 
which input method I need to invoke?  So it would be much easier to list 
such characters in a menu which shows their corresponding key 
invocations so I can use them also.

More importantly, the way that "I already have" is built into my Linux 
system.  I don't have to do anything for it to be there, because it's 
already there.  It's not something I need to do any kind of development 
on.  This already-existing functionality, called SCIM, also allows me to 
change to any one of 40 or 70 other input methods... and probably more 
in future as development on it continues.  And scim works for *all* apps 
on the entire system-- any and all web browsers, email apps, terminal 
windows, other editors I might use, including audio and video editors, 
etc., etc.--, not simply emacs.

So whether the emacs way is better or easier than scim is a moot point. 
  SCIM is already installed and working and quite useful.


>>   But I want a way so that all I need do is "C-xaa" to get 'ä'--
>> so I can type this and other characters without breaking the flow of my
>> typing.

This IMO is even easier than using SCIM and is what I'm trying to figure 
out how to code.  Often I need to type just a single character.  In such 
cases, switching input methods (regardless how it's done) is too much.


>
> Don't know if that helps, though...
>

Thanks for responding, but no, none of that was at all helpful.  I still 
want to create the sub-menu I originally described (the partial code for 
which no longer exists in this thread) and so still would like 
assistance formulating that code.  It would appear though that no one 
here knows how that would be done... or perhaps they're currently busy 
doing other things.  Getting *some* kind of reply is often better than 
dead silence, so conceivably yours were better than all the others I got.

Re: OT w/ misunderstanding Re: creating a sub-menu

[Joost Kremers]

Hi Ken,

ken wrote:
> Joost,
>
> For some reason your replies (from the outset of this conversation) 
> aren't showing up as part of one and the same thread.

I've been posting from two different computers, which may the the cause.

> On 03/06/2013 03:55 PM Joost Kremers wrote:
> Thanks for responding, but no, none of that was at all helpful.  I still 
> want to create the sub-menu I originally described (the partial code for 
> which no longer exists in this thread) and so still would like 
> assistance formulating that code.

I apologize for wasting your time. :-) To make up for it, I wanted to go
and figure out why your code wasn't working, but it seems the answer has
already been posted. Hope you get it working!


-- 
Joost Kremers                                   joostkremers@fastmail.fm
Selbst in die Unterwelt dringt durch Spalten Licht
EN:SiS(9)

Re: OT w/ misunderstanding Re: creating a sub-menu

[ken]

n 03/11/2013 03:47 PM Joost Kremers wrote:
> Hi Ken,
>
> ken wrote:
>> Joost,
>>
>> For some reason your replies (from the outset of this conversation)
>> aren't showing up as part of one and the same thread.
>
> I've been posting from two different computers, which may the the cause.

That by itself couldn't be the actual cause, not even should you be 
using different email programs on those two computers.  If you click 
"Reply"-- or for this particular list, "Reply All"-- the email program 
should maintain the threading of the conversation automatically for you 
(well, for all of us actually), regardless of which computer you do it 
on, regardless where on the internet those computers reside, etc.  This 
has been standard in email applications for a very long time.

In short, just click "Reply All" and everything should work fine.


>
>> On 03/06/2013 03:55 PM Joost Kremers wrote:
>> Thanks for responding, but no, none of that was at all helpful.  I still
>> want to create the sub-menu I originally described (the partial code for
>> which no longer exists in this thread) and so still would like
>> assistance formulating that code.
>
> I apologize for wasting your time. :-) To make up for it, I wanted to go
> and figure out why your code wasn't working, but it seems the answer has
> already been posted. Hope you get it working!

No need to apologize.  We're having a technical discussion, not a 
personal one.  It would help quite a bit in this regard though if, when 
you abridge the email you are replying to, the technical part of the 
discussion were not edited out.  Otherwise we're hearing the sound of 
one hand clapping.  If there's any doubt as to what's relevant, it would 
then be best just to leave the entirety of the quoted material intact.

Also, regarding "the answer", see my reply to Steve.

Re: OT w/ misunderstanding Re: creating a sub-menu

[Joost Kremers]

ken wrote:
>> I've been posting from two different computers, which may the the cause.
>
> That by itself couldn't be the actual cause, not even should you be 
> using different email programs on those two computers.  If you click 
> "Reply"-- or for this particular list, "Reply All"-- the email program 
> should maintain the threading of the conversation automatically for you 
> (well, for all of us actually), regardless of which computer you do it 
> on, regardless where on the internet those computers reside, etc.  This 
> has been standard in email applications for a very long time.

Well, I'm not actually *using* an email application. I'm reading this as
gnu.emacs.help.

> in short, just click "Reply All" and everything should work fine.

Alas, since I'm using a CLI client (slrn), I don't have a "reply all"
button. But in a news client, such a button wouldn't make much sense
anyway: any reply is a reply to all, that's what Usenet is all about.

FWIW, slrn displays all posts as one single thread, so from my point of
view, it's Thunderbird that's having trouble keeping the thread
together. (That may or may not be true, I don't know; it's just how it
looks on my end of the line.)

> No need to apologize.  We're having a technical discussion, not a 
> personal one.  It would help quite a bit in this regard though if, when 
> you abridge the email you are replying to, the technical part of the 
> discussion were not edited out.  Otherwise we're hearing the sound of 
> one hand clapping.  If there's any doubt as to what's relevant, it would 
> then be best just to leave the entirety of the quoted material intact.

The context is always there in the thread, so I generally cut all
details and leave enough so that the quoted text provides a summary of
what has been said. Of course it's always possible I snipped too much,
but generally I'm annoyed by messages where the first non-quoted text is
below the bottom of my screen when I open them... And since the
context is generally just a few keystrokes away (for me, anyway), I tend
to think that less is more.

> Also, regarding "the answer", see my reply to Steve.

Yeah, I read it. If I find some time, I might look into it a bit more,
but that probably won't be today or tomorrow...


-- 
Joost Kremers                                   joostkremers@fastmail.fm
Selbst in die Unterwelt dringt durch Spalten Licht
EN:SiS(9)

creating a sub-menu

[ken]

Trying to create a sub-menu under "Edit".  Got part of the way there, 
but still missing something.

(define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [insert-xascii-chars]
   '(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" xascii

    (xascii  "\C-xaa"   "ä"        "ä` (ä)"          ("ä"))
    (xascii  "\C-xaA"   "Ä"        "Ä` (Ä)"          ("Ä"))
    (xascii  "\C-xao"   "ö"        "ö` (ö)"          ("ö"))
    (xascii  "\C-xaO"   "Ö"        "Ö` (Ö)"          ("Ö"))
    (xascii  "\C-xau"   "ü"        "ü` (ü)"          ("ü"))
    (xascii  "\C-xaU"   "Ü"        "Ü` (Ü)"          ("Ü"))
    (xascii  "\C-xas"   "ß"        "ß` (ß)"          ("ß"))
    (xascii  "\C-xa<"   "«"        "«` («)"          ("«"))
    (xascii  "\C-xa>"   "»"        "»` (»)"          ("»"))))

Above yields error:
Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)

Re: creating a sub-menu

[Stephen Berman]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:39:01 -0500 ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:

> Trying to create a sub-menu under "Edit".  Got part of the way there, but
> still missing something.
>
> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [insert-xascii-chars]
>   '(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" xascii
>
>    (xascii  "\C-xaa"   "ä"        "ä` (ä)"          ("ä"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xaA"   "Ä"        "Ä` (Ä)"          ("Ä"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xao"   "ö"        "ö` (ö)"          ("ö"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xaO"   "Ö"        "Ö` (Ö)"          ("Ö"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xau"   "ü"        "ü` (ü)"          ("ü"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xaU"   "Ü"        "Ü` (Ü)"          ("Ü"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xas"   "ß"        "ß` (ß)"          ("ß"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xa<"   "«"        "«` («)"          ("«"))
>    (xascii  "\C-xa>"   "»"        "»` (»)"          ("»"))))
>
> Above yields error:
> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)

When I evaluate it in a recent Emacs build from the bzr trunk, I get no
error.  But instead of adding a submenu to the Edit menu, it just adds
the entry "Insert non-ASCII characters" (when I click on that entry, it
tries to execute the xascii command, and since I have that, I get "Lisp
error: (void-function xascii)").  If you want a submenu, then instead of
a command name, the third item in your menu-item list should be a
(variable whose value is a) keymap defining the menu items of the
submenu, e.g., something like the following:

(defun kg-insert-ä ()
  (interactive)
  (insert "ä"))

(defun kg-insert-Ä ()
  (interactive)
  (insert "Ä"))

(defvar xascii-menu
  (let ((menu (make-sparse-keymap "Insert non-ASCII characters")))
    (define-key menu [kg-insert-Ä]
      '(menu-item "Insert `Ä'" kg-insert-Ä :keys "C-x a A"))
    (define-key menu [kg-insert-ä]
      '(menu-item "Insert `ä'" kg-insert-ä :keys "C-x a a"))
    menu))

(define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [xascii-menu]
  `(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" ,xascii-menu))

Steve Berman

Re: creating a sub-menu

[ken]

On 03/07/2013 09:14 AM Stephen Berman wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:39:01 -0500 ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:
>
>> Trying to create a sub-menu under "Edit".  Got part of the way there, but
>> still missing something.
>>
>> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [insert-xascii-chars]
>>    '(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" xascii
>>
>>     (xascii  "\C-xaa"   "ä"        "ä` (ä)"          ("ä"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xaA"   "Ä"        "Ä` (Ä)"          ("Ä"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xao"   "ö"        "ö` (ö)"          ("ö"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xaO"   "Ö"        "Ö` (Ö)"          ("Ö"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xau"   "ü"        "ü` (ü)"          ("ü"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xaU"   "Ü"        "Ü` (Ü)"          ("Ü"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xas"   "ß"        "ß` (ß)"          ("ß"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xa<"   "«"        "«` («)"          ("«"))
>>     (xascii  "\C-xa>"   "»"        "»` (»)"          ("»"))))
>>
>> Above yields error:
>> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp xascii)
>
> When I evaluate it in a recent Emacs build from the bzr trunk, I get no
> error.  But instead of adding a submenu to the Edit menu, it just adds
> the entry "Insert non-ASCII characters" (when I click on that entry, it
> tries to execute the xascii command, and since I have that, I get "Lisp
> error: (void-function xascii)").  If you want a submenu, then instead of
> a command name, the third item in your menu-item list should be a
> (variable whose value is a) keymap defining the menu items of the
> submenu, e.g., something like the following:
>
> (defun kg-insert-ä ()
>    (interactive)
>    (insert "ä"))
>
> (defun kg-insert-Ä ()
>    (interactive)
>    (insert "Ä"))
>
> (defvar xascii-menu
>    (let ((menu (make-sparse-keymap "Insert non-ASCII characters")))
>      (define-key menu [kg-insert-Ä]
>        '(menu-item "Insert `Ä'" kg-insert-Ä :keys "C-x a A"))
>      (define-key menu [kg-insert-ä]
>        '(menu-item "Insert `ä'" kg-insert-ä :keys "C-x a a"))
>      menu))
>
> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [xascii-menu]
>    `(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" ,xascii-menu))
>
> Steve Berman

Thanks, Steve,

I tried this code and it is definitely progress over mine in that it 
displays menu items under the "Insert non-ASCII characters" heading. 
However, those non-ASCII characters (e.g., `Ä' and `ä') don't display in 
the menu under that heading properly; probably owing to the menu 
subsystem of the emacs frame not handling utf-8... or 8-bit characters 
of any kind.  Secondly, the key combos (e.g., C-xaA and C-xaa) remain 
undefined.

But you've advanced the code over what I had and I appreciate that very 
much.  The bit of explanation you provide is also helpful.  Together 
with the bits in the Elisp Manual and other sources on the web, the 
total picture on adding a sub-menu into an existing menu heading is 
starting to come together, though still I'm far from being able to 
articulate it the way I want and would need in order to be helpful to 
anyone else.  So I'll work on it more in whatever spare moments I have. 
  I'm sure I'll get it eventually.

Thanks again,
ken

Re: creating a sub-menu

[Stephen Berman]

On Tue, 12 Mar 2013 03:38:09 -0400 ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:

> On 03/07/2013 09:14 AM Stephen Berman wrote:
>
>> [...] If you want a submenu, then instead of
>> a command name, the third item in your menu-item list should be a
>> (variable whose value is a) keymap defining the menu items of the
>> submenu, e.g., something like the following:
>>
>> (defun kg-insert-ä ()
>>    (interactive)
>>    (insert "ä"))
>>
>> (defun kg-insert-Ä ()
>>    (interactive)
>>    (insert "Ä"))
>>
>> (defvar xascii-menu
>>    (let ((menu (make-sparse-keymap "Insert non-ASCII characters")))
>>      (define-key menu [kg-insert-Ä]
>>        '(menu-item "Insert `Ä'" kg-insert-Ä :keys "C-x a A"))
>>      (define-key menu [kg-insert-ä]
>>        '(menu-item "Insert `ä'" kg-insert-ä :keys "C-x a a"))
>>      menu))
>>
>> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [xascii-menu]
>>    `(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" ,xascii-menu))
>>
>> Steve Berman
>
> Thanks, Steve,
>
> I tried this code and it is definitely progress over mine in that it displays
> menu items under the "Insert non-ASCII characters" heading. However, those
> non-ASCII characters (e.g., `Ä' and `ä') don't display in the menu under that
> heading properly; probably owing to the menu subsystem of the emacs frame not
> handling utf-8... or 8-bit characters of any kind.  

They display fine in the menu in my Emacs.  If you're using a
Unicode-capable Emacs (23 or later), they should display for you too,
unless some setting in your system, or maybe some X setting, is
preventing it.

>                                                     Secondly, the key combos
> (e.g., C-xaA and C-xaa) remain undefined.

The use of :keys in a menu item is only for displaying in the menu the
string corresponding to a key binding that you have defined elsewhere,
either using global-set-key, local-set-key, or, if you only want them to
be used in a specific key map, using define-key.

> But you've advanced the code over what I had and I appreciate that very much.
> The bit of explanation you provide is also helpful.  Together with the bits in
> the Elisp Manual and other sources on the web, the total picture on adding a
> sub-menu into an existing menu heading is starting to come together, though
> still I'm far from being able to articulate it the way I want and would need
> in order to be helpful to anyone else.  So I'll work on it more in whatever
> spare moments I have. I'm sure I'll get it eventually.

Good luck!

Steve Berman

Re: creating a sub-menu

[ken]

n 03/12/2013 06:22 PM Stephen Berman wrote:
> On Tue, 12 Mar 2013 03:38:09 -0400 ken <gebser@mousecar.com> wrote:
>
>> On 03/07/2013 09:14 AM Stephen Berman wrote:
>>
>>> [...] If you want a submenu, then instead of
>>> a command name, the third item in your menu-item list should be a
>>> (variable whose value is a) keymap defining the menu items of the
>>> submenu, e.g., something like the following:
>>>
>>> (defun kg-insert-ä ()
>>>     (interactive)
>>>     (insert "ä"))
>>>
>>> (defun kg-insert-Ä ()
>>>     (interactive)
>>>     (insert "Ä"))
>>>
>>> (defvar xascii-menu
>>>     (let ((menu (make-sparse-keymap "Insert non-ASCII characters")))
>>>       (define-key menu [kg-insert-Ä]
>>>         '(menu-item "Insert `Ä'" kg-insert-Ä :keys "C-x a A"))
>>>       (define-key menu [kg-insert-ä]
>>>         '(menu-item "Insert `ä'" kg-insert-ä :keys "C-x a a"))
>>>       menu))
>>>
>>> (define-key menu-bar-edit-menu [xascii-menu]
>>>     `(menu-item "Insert non-ASCII characters" ,xascii-menu))
>>>
>>> Steve Berman
>>
>> Thanks, Steve,
>>
>> I tried this code and it is definitely progress over mine in that it displays
>> menu items under the "Insert non-ASCII characters" heading. However, those
>> non-ASCII characters (e.g., `Ä' and `ä') don't display in the menu under that
>> heading properly; probably owing to the menu subsystem of the emacs frame not
>> handling utf-8... or 8-bit characters of any kind.
>
> They display fine in the menu in my Emacs.  If you're using a
> Unicode-capable Emacs (23 or later), they should display for you too,
> unless some setting in your system, or maybe some X setting, is
> preventing it.

Good to know.  I'll have to remember that when I eventually get around 
to upgrading.  Until then I can use the '\xxx' (decimal) representations 
of them.


>
>>                                                      Secondly, the key combos
>> (e.g., C-xaA and C-xaa) remain undefined.
>
> The use of :keys in a menu item is only for displaying in the menu the
> string corresponding to a key binding that you have defined elsewhere,
> either using global-set-key, local-set-key, or, if you only want them to
> be used in a specific key map, using define-key.

Alright!  Didn't know that was needed, but cool, done already a lot... 
that's cake.


>
>> But you've advanced the code over what I had and I appreciate that very much.
>> The bit of explanation you provide is also helpful.  Together with the bits in
>> the Elisp Manual and other sources on the web, the total picture on adding a
>> sub-menu into an existing menu heading is starting to come together, though
>> still I'm far from being able to articulate it the way I want and would need
>> in order to be helpful to anyone else.  So I'll work on it more in whatever
>> spare moments I have. I'm sure I'll get it eventually.
>
> Good luck!
>
> Steve Berman

Thanks again, Steve.  Luck be with you too.