From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "R. Diez" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Separate area at the top for a serious tab bar Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2018 10:20:18 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <406844585.2241039.1529922018350@mail.yahoo.com> References: <376678535.4221832.1529478419186.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <376678535.4221832.1529478419186@mail.yahoo.com> <87bmbz8o9f.fsf@gmail.com> <16868055.1966258.1529907863571@mail.yahoo.com> <87a7rjw6zj.fsf@mbork.pl> Reply-To: "R. Diez" NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1529921951 17294 195.159.176.226 (25 Jun 2018 10:19:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2018 10:19:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: "help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org" , Jay Kamat To: Marcin Borkowski Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jun 25 12:19:06 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fXOaQ-0004MA-Ge for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 12:19:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:45247 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fXOcW-0001Fo-0q for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 06:21:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40332) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fXObh-0001Fg-9I for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 06:20:26 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fXObe-0006dO-4I for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 06:20:25 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic308-18.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com ([77.238.178.146]:37687) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fXObd-0006cJ-JX for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 06:20:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.de; s=s2048; t=1529922019; bh=wMUqJlOUMmVxSglz5+vNgnxo4SO5x1XY4Pzah9tic5Q=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject; b=mXSlw+ThPxZ3ErAOtiACg/TzBw551OTx1FRbNmtaetkyRkNuj8PfMq8TE2LF+L/GRjsDHkt1OES2n9Ek3xDgd6pYhYXDXJ1ubZdCi86FUbVMNLXGl77kmSPEZ6AifmysGdYmL0RyWL1lKA45MefJSOQ/iJPPk+ViLJaCx2CqaMyBfH44dV2YynZFhPMxZfKM/DRNmCG4HKqO4ZDOlbi5ZIjivU6OImr+kNU9ziXPBK0CL6f/69xRcL5b3VdO/N0GCMqfbPrak0GEE9qw42tABopD6ssRngKTwLw9F4tztEJDrw/1TNq8M/ioYKpS2HURCgT8052pIgfVBD3tYk/qjg== X-YMail-OSG: ZQSzYXgVM1ksqvAVSyboftEZaLD2JCL9wx3pYXIIhmChy6qpopqprZ8b76AQ4sx xzgkYdLsDs0AKSHrni0FkmpOIAvzJzyzWMkSz1wCq.9gUtcqfcKyWgMz7jyB0aj8gCd99CySJhSb lHPTc9Re9zvi9X_IXec6oHaZVf2uuUzIF.iF9mBJjOrsO1rGLD4NUF9GVobzn.NUVrK8M4gDQjID Nbne2w_M1TRtgeZdsntBas0RoE6h7pGk1IPBSC6sKndcAkFNZitd3paTIxZHVZAEs5XLgulxkBX_ nAtwv_rMUGGTrhnrmAw9xFQCn8_.SJGu6m3tUF6b6jXhk3eHG89A4Gwl22uDYvyrBkEebSGYaPMB Ee9ewV2cyP2.s5wir1LU6WMMJhGJRRxBBUaIBBzs4mm4TD.DKpvmXF257llktx9QCaARvLQtrh_k _pupCc.p7RuCnyx8US3B80.iDwTvW.IJUKcMjPSSSZQtyuI_ZpVZIVTlrPZgDQyEq9K03VAtofpp zcX1b9AW4qDAfAF.N5fwaslAnA_ZY.GWfbg0edCU24l497r._oIJLcvIzFhchIms0Dg9E9jL7USp XkiqhLQNcAt4m_pzZRY0GqoTcfY9458NBrNjGVftGIdf.goIJe.a3aJokpyhMysPYFFg9uTlRylz lYN1WsBnJpyLmDmqeaVXuxOX_ikiWRNJzzNPUNDhs6UZ6rfdNxW3D6g_MurN493ek7Vza3EiylLQ ABHE.XlmPAZE0Q_aoqaMRkiVbWSlj4sQknpG_tbsqrYzp5_PNbfVqaeAHld9pV9Yi4JFmhx_X.iL xXIN3VHhfwg_6lxdOZ2rg1TTzDJVerKAyW3akmKUmr Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic308.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 25 Jun 2018 10:20:19 +0000 In-Reply-To: <87a7rjw6zj.fsf@mbork.pl> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.12006 YahooMailNeo Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 77.238.178.146 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:117277 Archived-At: > [...] > Though I understand the "positional orientation" idea. This is a personal preference. Many people thrive in chaos. Other must have a tidy desktop. There is nothing wrong per se with each way. A tabbar does not preclude other buffer switching methods. I often have many buffers open. But I tend to keep the "local context" (the tabs that are visible right now) sorted (.h left from .cpp and so on). There is a tabbar in Firefox. There is one in most desktop environments (Windows, Xfce, KDE...). There will always be people and scenarios where a tabbar is the right approach, even in Emacs. I would not underestimate this kind of usability matter. It may well be one of the biggest factors driving people away from Emacs. It could even be a necessary evil until most people learn to do away with the tabbar. Humans are just like that. > [...] > (BTW, those keys don't work in my FF.) They are standard in Firefox: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/keyboard-shortcuts-perform-firefox-tasks-quickly#w_windows-tabs You are probably using a Linux desktop environment that is eating those key combinations. I had to tell mine to stop taking some key combinations for virtual desktop switching, which I personally do not use. > That is indeed neat, but isn't it fragile? It depends on you, > the user, ordering the tabs. This looks like something a computer could do. > [...] On the contrary. I am the user, and I rule. 8-) Automatic ordering here would not work. Sometimes, during testing, I keep seemingly-unrelated tabs next to each other. For example, a shell buffer next to the script I am testing right now, or the HTML page next to the C++ code that is generating it. I do most of my buffer switching without even looking at the tabbar, with just 1 or 2 quick keystrokes, because I intuitively know where the buffer I want is (2 steps left, or 1 step right). For a small group of related files, this positional hint works better (at least for me) than rotating over the last-visited buffers. Best regards, rdiez