GNU NTEmacs and X

GNU NTEmacs and X

[FRC]

Hi,

Is it possible to make GNU NTEmacs (21.3/winXP pro) use X (xfree86/cygwin,
latest) ?
I'm using a binary distro (followed links from gnu.org), compiled with
MSVC++ I suppose. I would like to be able to build it myself, but apparently
there are some makefile issues with cygwin.
Cygwin now provides an emacs package (cygwin port) that can use X, but I'd
rather have the choice to run it outside of cygwin.
My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X most
of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs without
X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE (eg. when I've to
work with many windows programs and switch between them very frequently -
there's then no point in having emacs in a fullscreen KDE).

Any suggestion? (hope this is not too much OT)

FRC

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Kai Großjohann]

IIRC, the CVS version of Emacs can be built normally under Cygwin,
presumably with X11 support.  I've never tried.
-- 
~/.signature

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "FRC" <frc--NoSpAm--@myrealbox.com>
> Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help
> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 20:28:47 +0200
> 
> Is it possible to make GNU NTEmacs (21.3/winXP pro) use X (xfree86/cygwin,
> latest) ?

As Kai points out, the CVS version of Emacs supports a Cygwin build,
and that build uses the Cygwin port of XFree.

> My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X most
> of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs without
> X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE

You might find that these goals conflict with each other (in
particular, a Cygwin build might not work well outside the Cygwin
installation), but the only way to know is to try.

Good luck!

X platform clipboard?

[Bruce Ingalls]

FRC wrote:
...
> My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X most
> of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs without
> X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE (eg. when I've to
> work with many windows programs and switch between them very frequently -
> there's then no point in having emacs in a fullscreen KDE).
> 
> Any suggestion? (hope this is not too much OT)

You might want to look at <url: http://kde-cygwin.sourceforge.net/ >
Sadly, it is far more sluggish, than
<url: http://cygnome.sourceforge.net/ >
even on a 1Ghz 256M RAM P4.

What is really nice about the latest Cygwin, is that plain X Window is 
now rootless by default, so no Window Manager is needed.

Perhaps you can remove the root X window, by clicking on the X symbol in 
the system tray.

I saw somewhere a program, that is supposed to facilitate sharing 
between the X clipboard and the w32 clipboard.
If someone has a recommendation, please post!

Re: X platform clipboard?

[FRC]

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"Bruce Ingalls" <bingalls@SpAmBlOcK.fit-zones.com> a écrit dans le message
de news:HiaVa.59345$852.57195@twister.nyc.rr.com...
> FRC wrote:
> ...
> > My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X
most
> > of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs
without
> > X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE (eg. when I've
to
> > work with many windows programs and switch between them very
frequently -
> > there's then no point in having emacs in a fullscreen KDE).
> >
> > Any suggestion? (hope this is not too much OT)
>
> You might want to look at <url: http://kde-cygwin.sourceforge.net/ >
That's this project that gave me the "idea" to work mainly under X with a
fullscreen window manager.

> Sadly, it is far more sluggish, than
> <url: http://cygnome.sourceforge.net/ >
> even on a 1Ghz 256M RAM P4.
I'll give it a try. So far my P4 3Ghz 2GB RAM has been doing fine :-)

> What is really nice about the latest Cygwin, is that plain X Window is
> now rootless by default, so no Window Manager is needed.
>
I know, but my goal is precisely to use a window manager and make my fav
progs (eg. Emacs) work with it.
Maybe this isn't worth the trouble, I dunno.

> Perhaps you can remove the root X window, by clicking on the X symbol in
> the system tray.
>
> I saw somewhere a program, that is supposed to facilitate sharing
> between the X clipboard and the w32 clipboard.
> If someone has a recommendation, please post!
Doesn't cygwin's Xwin got a -clipboard option? If not, try google on
xwinclip.exe (now we're completely OT)

FRC

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[FRC]

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"Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@elta.co.il> a écrit dans le message de
news:mailman.572.1059368245.8231.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org...
> > From: "FRC" <frc--NoSpAm--@myrealbox.com>
> > Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help
> > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 20:28:47 +0200
> >
> > Is it possible to make GNU NTEmacs (21.3/winXP pro) use X
(xfree86/cygwin,
> > latest) ?
>
> As Kai points out, the CVS version of Emacs supports a Cygwin build,
> and that build uses the Cygwin port of XFree.
Ok, I'm going to try it tonite.

> > My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X
most
> > of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs
without
> > X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE
>
> You might find that these goals conflict with each other (in
> particular, a Cygwin build might not work well outside the Cygwin
> installation), but the only way to know is to try.
>
> Good luck!
TY, I'll let u know guys if I make it out.

FRC

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Jason Dufair]

So you want to run it always in GUI mode, with X handling the GUI when
you're in X/KDE and Win32 handling the GUI when you don't have an X
server running?  I think you'll be unlikely to get this to work with the
current sources.

I suggest you use Cygwin's Emacs.  If you're "out of KDE," you could
have an X server running rootless that allows Emacs to run and appear to
be a regular Windows app (this is how I run it all the time and the
context in which I'm composing this post currently).  If you feel the
need to run in KDE, you're still covered.

"FRC" <frc--NoSpAm--@myrealbox.com> writes:

> Hi,
>
> Is it possible to make GNU NTEmacs (21.3/winXP pro) use X (xfree86/cygwin,
> latest) ?
> I'm using a binary distro (followed links from gnu.org), compiled with
> MSVC++ I suppose. I would like to be able to build it myself, but apparently
> there are some makefile issues with cygwin.
> Cygwin now provides an emacs package (cygwin port) that can use X, but I'd
> rather have the choice to run it outside of cygwin.
> My goal is to have only one Emacs install on my machine, use it under X most
> of the time (with KDE/xfree86/cygwin) BUT also be able to run Emacs without
> X (and not in a cmd.exe...) when I got to get out of KDE (eg. when I've to
> work with many windows programs and switch between them very frequently -
> there's then no point in having emacs in a fullscreen KDE).
>
> Any suggestion? (hope this is not too much OT)
>
> FRC
>
>

-- 
Jason Dufair - jase@dufair.org
http://www.dufair.org/
Crazy just thinkin' knowing that the world is round
And here I'm dancing on the ground
Never right side up or upside down
Is this real or am I dreaming?
-- Dave Matthews Band, "Crush"

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Kai Großjohann]

Jason Dufair <jase@dufair.org> writes:

> So you want to run it always in GUI mode, with X handling the GUI when
> you're in X/KDE and Win32 handling the GUI when you don't have an X
> server running?  I think you'll be unlikely to get this to work with the
> current sources.

Right.  But where's the problem of creating two binaries?  They could
share most of the actual installation.  I would guess that it should
suffice to create two binaries, and share all the other files.  There
might be a problem with the DOC file, though.
-- 
~/.signature

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Kevin Rodgers]

Kai Großjohann wrote:

> Jason Dufair <jase@dufair.org> writes:
>>So you want to run it always in GUI mode, with X handling the GUI when
>>you're in X/KDE and Win32 handling the GUI when you don't have an X
>>server running?  I think you'll be unlikely to get this to work with the
>>current sources.
>>
> 
> Right.  But where's the problem of creating two binaries?  They could
> share most of the actual installation.  I would guess that it should
> suffice to create two binaries, and share all the other files.  There
> might be a problem with the DOC file, though.

Ooh, that's a cool idea.  You would need to configure each build separately

(and run `make distclean` in betweeen), but I think you could build and install
separate executables (and share the other stuff) by configure'ing with e.g.

	--exec-prefix=/usr/local/x
and
	--exec-prefix=/usr/local/win32

-- 
Kevin Rodgers

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Eric Hanchrow]

>>>>> "Kai" == Kai Großjohann <kai.grossjohann@gmx.net> writes:

    Kai> But where's the problem of creating two binaries?  They could
    Kai> share most of the actual installation.  I would guess that it
    Kai> should suffice to create two binaries, and share all the
    Kai> other files.

I've had trouble (whose details I forget) sharing byte-compiled Lisp
between the NT and Cygwin versions of Emacs.

-- 
Asking the Iraqi people to assume Saddam's debts
is rather like telling a man who has been shot in the head
that he has to pay for the bullet.
        -- James Surowiecki

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[Jason Rumney]

Eric Hanchrow <offby1@blarg.net> writes:

> I've had trouble (whose details I forget) sharing byte-compiled Lisp
> between the NT and Cygwin versions of Emacs.

Were they different versions?  There should be no difference in byte
format between different platforms. I have successfully shared lisp
directories between Windows and GNU/Linux installations for years.
And recently someone fixed the DOC file differences between *nix and
W32, so the CVS version should be able to share that without problems
as well.

Re: GNU NTEmacs and X

[FRC]

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I indeed would like to be able to run un-cygwinized NTEmacs both with X and
no X.
The pb with cygwinized Emacs is for instance that it doesn't deal with NT
paths eg. C:\foo\bar. I can work around that wirh /cygdrive or a /c mount
point, but I'd rather not. I don't want it to pretend to be on *NIX, but
rather to be able to understand *NIX world.
BTW, I got a strange error when trying to build NTEmacs from CVS sources
with cygwin (make bootstrap)
-----------------------------------
gcc -c -I/usr/share/gettext   -Demacs -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -DUSE_LUCID  -I. -I/ho
me/FRC/emacs/src -I/usr/share/gettext -I/usr/X11R6/include -g xterm.c
xterm.c: In function `x_create_toolkit_scroll_bar':
xterm.c:4488: `XtNbeNiceToColormap' undeclared (first use in this function)
xterm.c:4488: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once
xterm.c:4488: for each function it appears in.)
make[1]: *** [xterm.o] Error 1
make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/FRC/emacs/src'
make: *** [bootstrap] Error 2

-----------------------------------
Googled a bit but didn't find anything. I got almost all latest cygwin
packages (apart from games etc...).

Rookie Q: what's that DOC file used for?

FRC

<jasonr (Jason Rumney) @ f2s.com> a écrit dans le message de
news:u7k5wgs7p.fsf@jasonrumney.net...
> Eric Hanchrow <offby1@blarg.net> writes:
>
> > I've had trouble (whose details I forget) sharing byte-compiled Lisp
> > between the NT and Cygwin versions of Emacs.
>
> Were they different versions?  There should be no difference in byte
> format between different platforms. I have successfully shared lisp
> directories between Windows and GNU/Linux installations for years.
> And recently someone fixed the DOC file differences between *nix and
> W32, so the CVS version should be able to share that without problems
> as well.
>