From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Jean-Christophe Helary Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs as a translator's tool Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2020 13:21:14 +0900 Message-ID: <38538C76-8BC4-4FEE-A906-7D2632BDF4A4@traduction-libre.org> References: <871rn35lqc.fsf@mbork.pl> <87zh9r45ad.fsf@mbork.pl> <87h7vz2m5g.fsf@ebih.ebihd> <87d06k4rmg.fsf@mbork.pl> <87eeqzmanl.fsf@ebih.ebihd> <877dwmoboq.fsf@mbork.pl> <87bllypckg.fsf@ebih.ebihd> <17720D3D-5DBA-4147-B495-FB24AC1A040B@traduction-libre.org> <877dwmpbef.fsf@ebih.ebihd> <1F4831E2-7BE4-43D9-8C62-FD7F2EA8A4DB@traduction-libre.org> <87367ap5iv.fsf@ebih.ebihd> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.80.23.2.2\)) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="57792"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Emanuel Berg Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Jun 05 06:50:47 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jh4Ja-000EvV-PX for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2020 06:50:46 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55574 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jh4JZ-0002CI-Rt for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2020 00:50:45 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42564) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jh4JH-0002BT-ST for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2020 00:50:27 -0400 Original-Received: from relay5-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.197]:49033) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jh4JG-0006fm-8U for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2020 00:50:27 -0400 X-Originating-IP: 111.89.103.91 Original-Received: from [10.0.1.13] (pl22363.ag1313.nttpc.ne.jp [111.89.103.91]) (Authenticated sender: jean.christophe.helary@traduction-libre.org) by relay5-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 839FA1C0004; Fri, 5 Jun 2020 04:50:20 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <87367ap5iv.fsf@ebih.ebihd> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.80.23.2.2) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.70.183.197; envelope-from=jean.christophe.helary@traduction-libre.org; helo=relay5-d.mail.gandi.net X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/06/05 00:50:22 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:123234 Archived-At: > On Jun 5, 2020, at 12:15, Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU = Emacs text editor wrote: >=20 > Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: >=20 >> I'm not sure I understand where you're drifting. >>=20 >> Idiomatic translations can be helped with tools, >> but as we see with MT, even the best tools still >> fail to produce correct idiomatic translations. >>=20 >> Which is the reason why I wrote "that is exactly >> what the translator is here for", meaning that the >> translator is here to ensure that the translation >> is idiomatic. >>=20 >> The tool can help the translator to produce >> a string that the translator will validate >> as idiomatic. >=20 > A file with common pitfalls and idiomatic > translations can help both machine AND human > translators find the idiomatic translation, or, if > there isn't one really, what people would say > instead... Indeed, and that is just a special case of what we call "contextual = matches" where the source text can match a number of translations but = only a few are correct in the context of the few previous or following = segments. So in terms of CAT functionality, such data would be included in a = translation memory, or a glossary file with comments, etc. --=20 Jean-Christophe Helary @brandelune http://mac4translators.blogspot.com