From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Ctrl-[ ? Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2019 10:44:04 +0200 Message-ID: <20190608084404.GB28228@tuxteam.de> References: <08AC8151-5911-40FA-8B20-818B839D00AB@traduction-libre.org> <86h892nk2g.fsf@zoho.eu> <9379C01B-80E3-49DD-B830-46CED773DC2C@traduction-libre.org> <83lfydrkde.fsf@gnu.org> <874l51q0s4.fsf@telefonica.net> <83ef45rdij.fsf@gnu.org> <87zhmto6fa.fsf@telefonica.net> <20190607163017.GA32029@tuxteam.de> <96B116FC-8007-4C42-9AE6-585530D0C76E@comcast.net> <87muisor2h.fsf@telefonica.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24" Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="29620"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 08 10:44:47 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxx-0007ZP-QP for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 10:44:46 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56302 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxw-0000I4-3m for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 04:44:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:37072) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxT-000074-Br for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 04:44:17 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxP-0007LF-NI for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 04:44:15 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.tuxteam.de ([5.199.139.25]:36295) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxO-0007JO-Vz for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 04:44:11 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuxteam.de; s=mail; h=From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:To:Date; bh=8MmG2S2s6SOuD4f+UUy4tQ6GK3HJyqmIn/PqE7przX0=; b=kvKz4SvDRkkmurYC9i5u/Eyt61+ZnSCIYS0tSwe2/wHwhG7p5IBoHZxI2akC45Ob4eqThBFJkIoH2q3kx/cY94BHUtMIjyae4e+DtboGZi4myy+8dOzVeWjdcDHZy5XZpMBJeOcw91WiVWaL3eDLwWQj8zeTFpAm2r5WXi9MaaCxc3p1mQz9se99E5UlImumbCY8xzIcr2zorNJTAPfq6/g/yPXzesE0/1WB5K1myknkA/t3XNs4vFe9vOS+dgf4gTpuEnkftm0Y089TXwnt4CygnBv7gIUfhPiBB+7GP01EgXl5n6CopfSshWbBzQQePB/672xrglnxK9Zi2GhgIQ==; Original-Received: from tomas by mail.tuxteam.de with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1hZWxI-0007RD-9Y for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jun 2019 10:44:04 +0200 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87muisor2h.fsf@telefonica.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 5.199.139.25 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:120831 Archived-At: --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Jun 08, 2019 at 02:31:50AM +0200, =C3=93scar Fuentes wrote: > Francis Belliveau writes: >=20 > > I think that a lot of you are missing the point that was made early on > > in the discussion. This mapping of ASCII cntrol characters is a > > definition made by convention since the day of the Teletype machines. > > It is how the ASCII character set was defined. >=20 > So what? Why a GUI user should be inconvenienced or prevented to bind > C-i, C-[, etc. to whatever he pleases the same way he binds any other > key combination? It /is/ possible: thus I don't quite understand your anger here. I think it's OK for it to be discouraged by default. It's OK for it to be discouraged for "official" Emacs packages. Because there's some value in Emacs behaving consistently across backends by default (as much as possible: it's clear that you can't display a PNG on a VT220, at least not without some compromise in quality). Perhaps the ways have to be documented better, and see Stefan's efforts in making it easier. Let me repeat here: there is some value in Emacs behaving consistently across backends (few editors out there, if any, cover the span from VT220 to X so elegantly). There are folks who use Emacs simultaneously with different backends. Cheers -- tom=C3=A1s --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlz7dVQACgkQBcgs9XrR2katUACffs58PCEbaYTWt7N96/blh9fD r4oAn3J4VbCuapsRjmt8F7hcWEWZGlDo =nlG2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --u3/rZRmxL6MmkK24--