From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Bob Proulx Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Where is Emacs Lisp taught ? Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2018 13:01:40 -0700 Message-ID: <20181115125227472708482@bob.proulx.com> References: <5B8BFDC9-A07B-48FE-8C97-1BB0B84E5577@gmail.com> <865zxruycx.fsf@zoho.com> <875zxr7zke.fsf@portable.galex-713.eu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1542312096 4632 195.159.176.226 (15 Nov 2018 20:01:36 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2018 20:01:36 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Nov 15 21:01:32 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gNNpR-000147-NP for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 21:01:29 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40566 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gNNrY-0005Cw-D9 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 15:03:40 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:35698) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gNNps-0004Cj-DZ for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 15:01:57 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gNNpo-0008Ju-Vd for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 15:01:56 -0500 Original-Received: from havoc.proulx.com ([96.88.95.61]:38884) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gNNpl-0008DL-3N for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 15:01:51 -0500 Original-Received: from joseki.proulx.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by havoc.proulx.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEC9B1828 for ; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 13:01:40 -0700 (MST) Original-Received: from hysteria.proulx.com (hysteria.proulx.com [192.168.230.119]) by joseki.proulx.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9819D2125A for ; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 13:01:40 -0700 (MST) Original-Received: by hysteria.proulx.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8680D2DC75; Thu, 15 Nov 2018 13:01:40 -0700 (MST) Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 96.88.95.61 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:118676 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier wrote: > > Programming editor commands has the additional advantage that a program need > > not be very large to be tangibly useful in editing. A first project can be > > very simple. One can thus slide very smoothly from using the editor to edit > > into learning to program with it. > > Of course, after 30 years of development, most of the things a beginner > will want has already been coded up, so the beginner's reaction nowadays > is to look for a package which provides the thing he's longing for. > Missing this opportunity to learn to hack along the way. I remember a master carpenter who said when new people came to him applying for a carpenter job that he would ask them to build two sawhorses by way of interview. By their work and results he could judge if they were competent enough to hire or not. The task is one that can be easily accomplished by someone trying to hire on as a carpenter in a short amount of time. And sawhorses are always useful to have around a job site. I have often felt that in recent years we have lost the idea that a tool builder should build their own tools. Bob