From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Bob Proulx Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Newsgroups mailing-list gateway broken thread Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2018 12:44:57 -0600 Message-ID: <20181018121955500722783@bob.proulx.com> References: <87lg6w43k8.fsf@portable.galex-713.eu> <861s8nefj5.fsf@zoho.com> <874ldjtcow.fsf@portable.galex-713.eu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1539888319 15422 195.159.176.226 (18 Oct 2018 18:45:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2018 18:45:19 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 18 20:45:15 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gDDIJ-0003v5-EM for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 20:45:15 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43886 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gDDKQ-0007fl-0A for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 14:47:26 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:43081) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gDDI8-0006Tw-Kn for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 14:45:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gDDI3-0001K8-Ef for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 14:45:04 -0400 Original-Received: from havoc.proulx.com ([96.88.95.61]:60685) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gDDI3-0001Ig-7j for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 14:44:59 -0400 Original-Received: from joseki.proulx.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by havoc.proulx.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 991D6B59 for ; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 12:44:57 -0600 (MDT) Original-Received: from hysteria.proulx.com (hysteria.proulx.com [192.168.230.119]) by joseki.proulx.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62BBC21804 for ; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 12:44:57 -0600 (MDT) Original-Received: by hysteria.proulx.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 4E6582DC74; Thu, 18 Oct 2018 12:44:57 -0600 (MDT) Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <874ldjtcow.fsf@portable.galex-713.eu> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 96.88.95.61 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:118330 Archived-At: Garreau, Alexandre wrote: > Emanuel Berg wrote: > > Garreau, Alexandre wrote: > >> After some discussion I=E2=80=99ve realized that in > >> fact mailing traversing the newsgroups > >> mailing-list gateway receive different > >> message-ids in their references, which, in my > >> mail user-agent (gnus) break the threads. Yes. When users post to the newsgroup and it is gatewayed into the mailing list it breaks threading. > >> I say that because it appears not to break > >> anything on the mailing-list archive web > >> interface (and to affect most if not all of It does break on the web interface too. It's no different there than anywhere else. Messages from the newsgroup break threading and start a new thread. :-( > >> newsgroup posters), so I=E2=80=99d like how does it > >> do (does it have mappings of all correct > >> message-ids to other message-ids?), and how > >> other users of the mailing-list do, or what > >> can be done to improve the situation. There isn't anything special about the web interface. Threading is broken there the same as elsewhere. Therefore there is no magic to extract from there to add to your own to fix threading. > >> Thanks for any information. > > (Important note: This post is *not* sent thru > > gnu.emacs.help, but from gmane.emacs.help - > > like I say below, it is 20 times slower. But: > > how do the references look now?) >=20 > The references are just fine, they correctly references my message. ... > I expect the newsgroups gateway *should* work. So this is to fix, > rather than suggesting gmane as a workaround (the issue of it being > slower is a separate issue). Emanuel, We have talked about this before. :-) > I believe this is be on the GNU side, because I saw references referrin= g > to same garbled message-ids, with =E2=80=9Cmailman=E2=80=9D in them: so= if different > newsgroup users, such as Emanual Berg and Barry Margolin gets the same > references while using different gateways to usenet, and this one has > =E2=80=9Cmailman=E2=80=9D in it, I think it is not only common to all n= ewsgroups users > (thus coming from GNU), but also coming from either mailman, either > something interfacing with it, I guess. >=20 > The question is why. This is a deja vu as we have discussed this before. This link jumps right into some detail from that previous discussion. http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2016-06/msg00147.html Of course the web email address redactor with all of the address hidden redactions make reading that on the web quite difficult. One could ftp down the mailbox and then have the full mailbox of messages. AFAICT messages through the Stanford newsgroup to email relay do not include the In-Reply-To header and therefore break threading. A message may have the References header with information about previous messages in the thread causing the message to thread before where it should thread, and if only one deep them be completely disconnected from the original thread. In the intervening two years since the previous discussion nothing substantial has happened. Bob