[Rmail] Fighting spam

[Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

Hello,

with latest Rmail development, what is the simplest method to protect
myself agaisnt spam ? THere are a few messages that are auto-magicallly
labeled with a « spam » keyword but I can't find why it happens :)

I need a way ton instruct this protector with other material to get him
even better.

Thank you for your help

-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Jude DaShiell]

Forward spam to me@rescam.org.  You will protect more than yourself
doing so.  That service will redirect the spammer so it responds to the
rescam.org service specifically and when that happens the rescam.org
service has a bot that wastes so much of the spammer's time it ends up
costing the spammer money.

This doesn't just work with a single e-mail package either.
On Wed, 30 May
2018, Xavier Maillard wrote:

> Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 09:01:23
> From: Xavier Maillard <xavier@maillard.im>
> To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> Subject: [Rmail] Fighting spam
>
> Hello,
>
> with latest Rmail development, what is the simplest method to protect
> myself agaisnt spam ? THere are a few messages that are auto-magicallly
> labeled with a ? spam ? keyword but I can't find why it happens :)
>
> I need a way ton instruct this protector with other material to get him
> even better.
>
> Thank you for your help
>
>

-- 

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

> Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 09:51:36 -0400
> From: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> Forward spam to me@rescam.org.  You will protect more than yourself
> doing so.  That service will redirect the spammer so it responds to the
> rescam.org service specifically and when that happens the rescam.org
> service has a bot that wastes so much of the spammer's time it ends up
> costing the spammer money.
> 
> This doesn't just work with a single e-mail package either.

Noted it but it won't help for figthing in input, will it ?

I found rmail-spam-filter. Just reading its info page.

-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Jude DaShiell]

You mean pictures sent as e-mail messages?  It shouldn't have any
problem with them either since the e-mail got to you you can send it as
an fwd if necessary as a mime attachment to me@rescam.org and let the
bots have fun with your spammer.

On Wed, 30 May 2018, Xavier Maillard wrote:

> Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 13:10:58
> From: Xavier Maillard <xavier@maillard.im>
> To: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com>
> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam
>
> > Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 09:51:36 -0400
> > From: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> >
> > Forward spam to me@rescam.org.  You will protect more than yourself
> > doing so.  That service will redirect the spammer so it responds to the
> > rescam.org service specifically and when that happens the rescam.org
> > service has a bot that wastes so much of the spammer's time it ends up
> > costing the spammer money.
> >
> > This doesn't just work with a single e-mail package either.
>
> Noted it but it won't help for figthing in input, will it ?
>
> I found rmail-spam-filter. Just reading its info page.
>
>

-- 

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[James K. Lowden]

On Wed, 30 May 2018 09:51:36 -0400
Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com> wrote:

> Forward spam to me@rescam.org.  

	"After sending more than a million emails to scammers Re:scam
will be powering down for some R&R and R&D from 18 December 2017. "
	-- https://www.netsafe.org.nz/rescam/

--jkl

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Emanuel Berg]

One can use the Gnus scoring system which in
combination with not spreading one's e-mail
everywhere on the web has worked fine for me.

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

> One can use the Gnus scoring system which in
> combination with not spreading one's e-mail
> everywhere on the web has worked fine for me.

Well, Gnus is not Rmail, is it ? I am not sure I understand correctly
your answer.

Regards
-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Emanuel Berg]

Xavier Maillard wrote:

>> One can use the Gnus scoring system which in
>> combination with not spreading one's e-mail
>> everywhere on the web has worked fine
>> for me.
>
> Well, Gnus is not Rmail, is it?

It may be worth considering if you are not too
ingrained with Rmail already. Because of spam
and other reasons.

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Eric Brown]

This has nothing to do with a "spam filter" for Rmail.

It is a service to annoy phishers enough that they may go away.

Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com> writes:

> You mean pictures sent as e-mail messages?  It shouldn't have any
> problem with them either since the e-mail got to you you can send it as
> an fwd if necessary as a mime attachment to me@rescam.org and let the
> bots have fun with your spammer.
>
> On Wed, 30 May 2018, Xavier Maillard wrote:
>
>> Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 13:10:58
>> From: Xavier Maillard <xavier@maillard.im>
>> To: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com>
>> Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
>> Subject: Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam
>>
>> > Date: Wed, 30 May 2018 09:51:36 -0400
>> > From: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>> >
>> > Forward spam to me@rescam.org.  You will protect more than yourself
>> > doing so.  That service will redirect the spammer so it responds to the
>> > rescam.org service specifically and when that happens the rescam.org
>> > service has a bot that wastes so much of the spammer's time it ends up
>> > costing the spammer money.
>> >
>> > This doesn't just work with a single e-mail package either.
>>
>> Noted it but it won't help for figthing in input, will it ?
>>
>> I found rmail-spam-filter. Just reading its info page.
>>
>>

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Eric Brown]

Xavier Maillard <xavier@maillard.im> writes:

> Hello,
>
> with latest Rmail development, what is the simplest method to protect
> myself agaisnt spam ? THere are a few messages that are auto-magicallly
> labeled with a « spam » keyword but I can't find why it happens :)
>
> I need a way ton instruct this protector with other material to get him
> even better.
>
> Thank you for your help

Hi Xavier,

I see that you've already found:

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/RmailSpamprobe

But the other possibility is:

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/RmailSpamFilter

which might be tailored to catch the specific spam keyword that appears
in your headers.

I'm not aware of any integrated Rmail/spamfilter solution that makes it
act like those found in traditional GUIs, e.g. marking spam messages in
Rmail and then submitting them to an ever-improving spam filter.  (Of
course there are things like spamassassin, but it doesn't seem
integrated.)

In my own solution, I simply use the spam filter of my provider's web
interface (fastmail) and also use Gnus for filtering.

Clearly you are interested in Rmail solution and perhaps you're locked
to your provider. Just trying to explain one of the reasons that I don't
use Rmail and do use something else, though Rmail is a fine program.)

Best regards,
Eric

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

> Xavier Maillard wrote:
> 
> >> One can use the Gnus scoring system which in
> >> combination with not spreading one's e-mail
> >> everywhere on the web has worked fine
> >> for me.
> >
> > Well, Gnus is not Rmail, is it?
> 
> It may be worth considering if you are not too
> ingrained with Rmail already. Because of spam
> and other reasons.

Well, too complex for my usage 1) and 2) with such tools I tend to
spend too much time tweaking thigs up instead of doing what needs to
get done.

-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Emanuel Berg]

Xavier Maillard wrote:

> Well, too complex for my usage 1) and 2) with
> such tools I tend to spend too much time
> tweaking thigs up instead of doing what needs
> to get done.

It is true that Gnus is much more advanced than
Rmail but it is also more powerful and power
can be made simple, just think of
Luke Skywalker, George W., and others.

I was once an Rmail user but has used Gnus for
many years and I can say those play in
different leagues.

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Bob Proulx]

Xavier Maillard wrote:
> with latest Rmail development, what is the simplest method to protect
> myself agaisnt spam ? THere are a few messages that are auto-magicallly
> labeled with a « spam » keyword but I can't find why it happens :)
> 
> I need a way ton instruct this protector with other material to get him
> even better.

IIRC the Rmail rules are able to classify the reading and display of
both non-spam and spam messages but is not a spam classification
engine itself.  For that you would probably look to using SpamAssassin
or another spam classification engine such as BogoFilter or other or
some combination of all of the above.  I am currently using a pipeline
through bogofilter and spamassassin.  However even better is to avoid
receiving the spam in the first place by using a DNSBL such as the Xen
list from Spamhaus.  Best is combined arms tactics using a combination
of available techniques.

You didn't say how email is getting delivered to your system.  It
would be necessary to know this before being able to suggest something
that would fit into that flow.  The classic traditional way is through
the MTA such as Postfix in which case you can use Procmail to run
messages through BogoFilter and SpamAssassin for classification and
then use Procmail to file them into appropriate folders.  But many
(most?) people these days use an IMAP server for email which requires
yet different techniques.

Bob

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

Hello Bob,

> Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2018 11:19:22 -0600
> From: Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com>
> 
> Xavier Maillard wrote:
> > with latest Rmail development, what is the simplest method to protect
> > myself agaisnt spam ? THere are a few messages that are auto-magicallly
> > labeled with a « spam » keyword but I can't find why it happens :)
> > 
> > I need a way ton instruct this protector with other material to get him
> > even better.
> 
> IIRC the Rmail rules are able to classify the reading and display of
> both non-spam and spam messages but is not a spam classification
> engine itself.  For that you would probably look to using SpamAssassin
> or another spam classification engine such as BogoFilter or other or
> some combination of all of the above.  I am currently using a pipeline
> through bogofilter and spamassassin.  However even better is to avoid
> receiving the spam in the first place by using a DNSBL such as the Xen
> list from Spamhaus.  Best is combined arms tactics using a combination
> of available techniques.

Got it.

I am not getting that much spam these days but having some tools and
techniques to fight it when a spam wave comes by may be useful.

> You didn't say how email is getting delivered to your system.

For a couple of years I was geting to my mail through IMAP servers but
I was not satisfied having my e-mails stored and synced on every devices I was
using. I have now switched back to POP and a sole copy on 1 computer and only 1.

I have defined `rmail-primary-inbox-alist' to '("po:...").

There is no other tool in the workflow (I got rid of
fetchmail/getmail, procmail and the like).

Regards
-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Bob Proulx]

Xavier Maillard wrote:
> Bob Proulx wrote:
> > You didn't say how email is getting delivered to your system.
> 
> For a couple of years I was geting to my mail through IMAP servers but
> I was not satisfied having my e-mails stored and synced on every devices I was
> using. I have now switched back to POP and a sole copy on 1 computer and only 1.

I just find IMAP to be quite slow, especially as compared to having
the files locally available and cached in file system buffer cache.

> I have defined `rmail-primary-inbox-alist' to '("po:...").
> 
> There is no other tool in the workflow (I got rid of
> fetchmail/getmail, procmail and the like).

If you do end up with a spam problem in the future you might consider
filtering your email through a spam classification system like
spamassassin or something similar on the way into your mailbox.
Perhaps fetching into a spooling folder and then filtering into a main
folder.  Or something similar.  But I think rmail by itself is going
to depend upon an external filter for it to at least add headers, just
like most mail readers these days.

Bob

Re: [Rmail] Fighting spam

[Xavier Maillard]

> Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2018 23:35:28 -0600
> From: Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com>
> 
> Xavier Maillard wrote:
> > Bob Proulx wrote:
> > > You didn't say how email is getting delivered to your system.
> > 
> > For a couple of years I was geting to my mail through IMAP servers but
> > I was not satisfied having my e-mails stored and synced on every devices I was
> > using. I have now switched back to POP and a sole copy on 1 computer and only 1.
> 
> I just find IMAP to be quite slow, especially as compared to having
> the files locally available and cached in file system buffer cache.

True. At the time I was depending on IMAP, I used to install
OfflineImap to get it of this problematic. But, in the end, why use
IMAP at all ? I'd rather have this right in my local FS and not spread
on many unsecured devices (with latest events around privacy, that
would not hurt to get better control of that).

> > I have defined `rmail-primary-inbox-alist' to '("po:...").
> > 
> > There is no other tool in the workflow (I got rid of
> > fetchmail/getmail, procmail and the like).
> 
> If you do end up with a spam problem in the future you might consider
> filtering your email through a spam classification system like
> spamassassin or something similar on the way into your mailbox.
> Perhaps fetching into a spooling folder and then filtering into a main
> folder.  Or something similar.  But I think rmail by itself is going
> to depend upon an external filter for it to at least add headers, just
> like most mail readers these days.

Right, it needs an external tool so I guess I will have to use getmail
+ SA for example at some point.

That's a pity since, after all, it will just be used to add headers
and let Rmail automatically "discard" -ie. dispatch into different
files.


-- 
Xavier Maillard                      
e/j:xavier@maillard.im               w:www.maillard.im
m: 06 52 18 63 43
GPG: 9983 DCA1 1FAC 8DA7 653A  F9AA BA49 09B7 8F04 DE1B