From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Xavier Maillard Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: emacs-w3m question Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2008 00:25:26 +0100 Organization: GNU's Not UNIX! Message-ID: <200811032325.mA3NPQZN009176@zogzog.maillard.mobi> References: <87vdvdu4mp.fsf@literaturlatenight.de> <74160b46-e541-436a-a776-c8bd53d6cd55@o4g2000pra.googlegroups.com> <200810302125.m9ULP2AB006684@zogzog.maillard.mobi> <87bpx1g23o.fsf@gmail.com> <200811031125.mA3BPKiH024523@zogzog.maillard.mobi> Reply-To: Xavier Maillard NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1225863076 28941 80.91.229.12 (5 Nov 2008 05:31:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2008 05:31:16 +0000 (UTC) Cc: rileyrgdev@gmail.com, help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Richard Riley Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 05 06:32:18 2008 connect(): Connection refused Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1Kxb02-0002tn-LX for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 06:32:14 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52019 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Kxayv-00009g-Pc for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:31:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Kxax7-0007f3-PV for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:29:13 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Kxax5-0007du-10 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:29:12 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=57274 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Kxax4-0007dV-LO for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:29:10 -0500 Original-Received: from master.uucpssh.org ([193.218.105.66]:41646) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Kxax4-0001yF-Ox for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:29:11 -0500 Original-Received: by master.uucpssh.org (Postfix, from userid 10) id 0D4D9F4110; Wed, 5 Nov 2008 06:27:51 +0100 (CET) Original-Received: from zogzog.maillard.mobi (IDENT:1000@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zogzog.maillard.mobi (8.14.2/8.13.8) with ESMTP id mA3NPQna009177; Tue, 4 Nov 2008 00:25:26 +0100 Original-Received: (from xma@localhost) by zogzog.maillard.mobi (8.14.2/8.13.8/Submit) id mA3NPQZN009176; Tue, 4 Nov 2008 00:25:26 +0100 In-reply-to: (message from Richard Riley on Mon, 03 Nov 2008 13:13:39 +0100) User-Agent: Rmail in GNU Emacs 23.0.60.12 on GNU/Linux Jabber-ID: xma01@jabber.fr X-uucpssh: Found to be clean X-uucpssh-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (not cached, score=-4.344, required 4.6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, AWL 0.06, BAYES_00 -2.60, SPF_HELO_PASS -0.00) X-uucpssh-From: xma@gnu.org X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:59454 Archived-At: Hi, Xavier Maillard writes: > Xavier Maillard writes: > > > Xavier> For your information, many old computers do not have > > Xavier> Up/Down/Left/Right keys thus making this as a default won't work > > Xavier> for them. I never use these key due to my habits. Therefor > > Xavier> I strongly disagree with you on that point. > > > > Defaults are for newcomers to quickly get hands on the thing. > > > > I do not see why defaults should apply to newcomers, really. > > Defaults must apply to the mass (either power users or newcomers). > > > > Xavier > > The mass have arrow keys. As do 99.99999999999999999% of all new comers. > > Yes I have it on my laptop but I never used them because they are > located to an improbable and unpractical location. > > Xavier With all due respect, the location of the arrow keys on one laptop seem a dubious pivot for making decisions for a configurable base product which is aimed at a wide and varied user base. The great majority have arrow keys, the HW manufacturers built them in ( I haven't seen a keyboard without them for years). To ignore them because of a minorities poorly designed, antiquated or specialised HW seems somewhat silly. Note: they are not easily accessible for *me*. It does not mean they are badly designed or wrongly placed. I am pretty sure many people use them and like that. I do not like to move my fingers too much thus keeping them on the most important part: letters. Are they the *best* things for hard core Emacs user? Possibly not. Would a lot of users be confused if they did not work as common sense dictates? Almost certainly. That makes me thing the not so glorious past days of the free software movement where creativity meant mimicry. Nevermind, it is becoming even more OT. Having said that, I'm sure you are not arguing against configuring them. Absolutely not. Xavier -- http://www.gnu.org http://www.april.org http://www.lolica.org