unofficial mirror of help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: Carson Chittom <carson@wistly.net>, help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: configurable means hard?  [was: ... easier explanation how to setup gnus ...]
Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2013 12:01:03 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1851107a-51f8-4514-a47d-0d0a6ce4fc4b@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <8761v9fp6k.fsf@abbey.wistly.net>

> But Gnus' defining feature is its configurability, and therefore
> complexity: because it's so complex it's *hard* and you have to be
> able to read the instructions, by and large, to do much that's useful.

Hm.  I hear you, and though not very familiar with Gnus I can
sympathize to some extent with this point of view.

But I think that the goal should be something that (I think) Emacs
achieves pretty well: it is configurable as hell, and it can be as
complex as you like, but it ALSO lets uninformed users pick it up
and start using it right away, out of the box.

Others will disagree, but I think that, yes, you CAN pick up Emacs
and just start using it, in particular if you make use of the menus.
And (others will disagree, but) that is a good thing.

Others will disagree, but I think that it is important that users
be able to access something that can be complex at different levels,
including virtually total ignorance.

It is important to try (TRY, at least) to hide complexity and reveal
it only as needed, on demand.  Users should not NEED to configure
something and grok its innards before they can use it.  They should
BE ABLE to configure it and learn progressively about its guts and
advanced features.

Knowledgable users should be able to fix and reroute the plumbing
at will, but users also deserve some porcelain and should not be
REQUIRED to be plumbers to be able to open the faucet etc.

And yes, I also hear that last qualification you wrote: "to do much
that's useful".  The "much" is relative, however.  A new and naive
user of Emacs can already do a fair amount that is useful, as soon
as s?he opens the box.  Maybe not so useful in the eyes of a more
knowledgable user, but useful all the same.



  reply	other threads:[~2013-08-13 19:01 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 37+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-08-13  2:54 What's an even easier explanation how to setup gnus Don Saklad
2013-08-13  7:11 ` Thorsten Jolitz
     [not found] ` <mailman.3094.1376377917.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-13 14:55   ` Stefan Monnier
2013-08-13 15:41     ` Thorsten Jolitz
     [not found]     ` <mailman.3131.1376408540.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-13 16:23       ` Stefan Monnier
2013-08-28  9:49       ` Glen Stark
2013-09-02 11:44         ` Thorsten Jolitz
2013-09-02 13:20           ` Jambunathan K
2013-09-02 21:26           ` W. Greenhouse
2013-09-03 12:35             ` Richard Riley
     [not found]           ` <mailman.1212.1378157299.10748.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-09-02 22:01             ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2013-09-03  0:58               ` W. Greenhouse
2013-09-03  2:12             ` Rustom Mody
2013-09-03  2:44               ` W. Greenhouse
2013-09-03 12:36                 ` Richard Riley
     [not found]               ` <mailman.1233.1378176315.10748.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-09-03  3:56                 ` Rustom Mody
2013-09-03 12:38                   ` Richard Riley
2013-09-03 14:37                     ` Stefan Monnier
2013-09-03 16:44                     ` W. Greenhouse
2013-09-03 20:13                       ` Jambunathan K
     [not found]                       ` <mailman.1282.1378239114.10748.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-09-04  3:40                         ` Rustom Mody
2013-09-02 13:55         ` Jambunathan K
2013-08-13 17:58 ` Carson Chittom
2013-08-13 19:01   ` Drew Adams [this message]
2013-08-13 20:30     ` configurable means hard? [was: ... easier explanation how to setup gnus ...] Carson Chittom
2013-08-13 21:01       ` Drew Adams
2013-08-14  5:19         ` Yuri Khan
     [not found]         ` <mailman.3178.1376457548.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-14  5:26           ` Rustom Mody
2013-08-14 14:05           ` Stefan Monnier
     [not found]     ` <mailman.3159.1376425851.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-14 14:02       ` Stefan Monnier
2013-08-14 14:44         ` Drew Adams
2013-08-14 17:14         ` Rustom Mody
2013-08-16 18:40           ` Ken Goldman
     [not found]           ` <mailman.188.1376678430.10748.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-17 10:59             ` Rustom Mody
     [not found]   ` <mailman.3146.1376420497.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-14  3:11     ` Jason Rumney
2013-08-13 20:17 ` What's an even easier explanation how to setup gnus W. Greenhouse
     [not found] ` <mailman.3154.1376425093.12400.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2013-08-14  3:29   ` Rustom Mody

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

  List information: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=1851107a-51f8-4514-a47d-0d0a6ce4fc4b@default \
    --to=drew.adams@oracle.com \
    --cc=carson@wistly.net \
    --cc=help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).