From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: uzibalqa Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Pressing ? does not allow window scrolling through the list of info commands Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2023 11:38:32 +0000 Message-ID: <14KP-ia-06yjAh-_mSMzvtPr1r24o2Csrt1AZWdGWTTN2OfCHNEcTkbmUFJaAeHHZZmkW5S3QypOZdaAMZG9RnU-ApcaB8nsuaTXFphsZGg=@proton.me> References: <83bkgoguea.fsf@gnu.org> <837crcgra6.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="28885"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 07 13:47:07 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qHjvV-0007Fe-Mo for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 13:47:05 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHjne-0005Aj-8e; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 07:38:58 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHjnV-00051i-9h for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 07:38:50 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-40135.protonmail.ch ([185.70.40.135]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHjnS-00013x-PT; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 07:38:49 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=proton.me; s=protonmail; t=1688729923; x=1688989123; bh=T1/MHYyVbMPZA32mIoeis2vophvLwxdtMS0xlI+UBt8=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: Feedback-ID:From:To:Cc:Date:Subject:Reply-To:Feedback-ID: Message-ID:BIMI-Selector; b=TxnGdrFjFtfUCYFkX95Zk96A8hULgEv0fS8Nph4x8dlFViW2FCJY+O2GvE2ow3crU p9sF0D/PESmAQ9TDKfTDBgN4t5GZtlG+jbyYgVoi5bxOuSLCSrq1q+wsI/ZSGbw6WV fsXbnJVj/vEQF5rFriDlvNuJPNFNdCyKWX64NozDyuAZ89YYV1lsYMENOlgRMJYVBX nRhBN8izAW4e7z76OPc5W9enl0Tuh+TKbyYxnSZbRaewDN1Gpwl9FD122C78D25BgU TB4XZqSFFxzcSeMNU5s56XpPr6RfdCG+DwVU3Ucj7++FNvJkocmeuXX6YAymXzpZtD nQptn8XspWBYw== In-Reply-To: <837crcgra6.fsf@gnu.org> Feedback-ID: 52887082:user:proton Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.70.40.135; envelope-from=uzibalqa@proton.me; helo=mail-40135.protonmail.ch X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:144147 Archived-At: ------- Original Message ------- On Friday, July 7th, 2023 at 6:38 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > From: Yuri Khan yuri.v.khan@gmail.com > > Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2023 13:00:30 +0700 > > Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org > >=20 > > However, what is the reason for that event loop? >=20 >=20 > The reason is to allow return to the manual with minimal fuss. As the > user who invokes "?" is very likely to be a newbie to Emacs, having > them to deal with buffers and windows at this point is unwise, to say > the least. For newbies it is even more strange to see oneself getting diverted back to the manual, considering that many are used to traverse a buffer with the arrow keys or mouse scroll. Particularly when such buffer scrolling operations work as expected within the manual. =20 =20 > For the same reason, the first screenful displayed by "?" should show > all of the essential commands, leaving the next screenful to show the > advanced and more rarely-used ones. >=20 > I'm not saying I object to adding more keys to scroll the display > there, but the simplicity of going back to the manual should be > preserved. The informational note about how to traverse the buffer shewn in the=20 Echo Area should be written at the beginning, as soon as the newbie (or not) gets to the '?' page. =20